Official feedback thread re: the new leveling system

[karlaofficial]

I’m actually pretty shocked. I thought with the mammoth amount of negative feedback that fiverr has received regarding the changes, that they may consider making some careful changes and being more considerate and maybe extending the amount of time before this is being implemented, and it looks like they are not doing any of that. They are stubborn, and they are sticking to their plan with implementing this, and they are still not providing the level of transparency that is needed. Truly shocking. Very disappointing to see that sellers on the platform can be treated like this. 

[leannelrivers]

12 hours ago, terrygrantvo said:

Yeah, I've never understood that either.

Same with some VO gigs. 

"I will record you a British accent voiceover."

"I will record you a voiceover in a British accent."

"British accent voiceover? I will record it."

"British female voiceover recorded for you."

"recorded for you: Female British voiceover."

"I'm female. I'm British. I record voiceover."

[priyank_mod]

17 minutes ago, leannelrivers said:

Same with some VO gigs. 

"I will record you a British accent voiceover."

"I will record you a voiceover in a British accent."

"British accent voiceover? I will record it."

"British female voiceover recorded for you."

"recorded for you: Female British voiceover."

"I'm female. I'm British. I record voiceover."

Real-life gigs demonstrating application of Active-Passive Voice!! 👀😂

[leannelrivers]

5 hours ago, karlaofficial said:

Very disappointing to see that sellers on the platform can be treated like this.

Thanks for starting a new post, Frank. I'm amazed it took them so long to shut the other one down. 
As probably most of us knew, no amount of anger and venting was going to change this. The Fiverr team appears to be very pleased with themselves. I hope that wording in the review, like 'Value for Money' and 'Exceptional', is seriously reconsidered. However, those two things are already lowering the ratings of sellers of all levels, which is the whole point of this change. 
I'm less distressed about it than many because I've been dealing with a drastic reduction in orders for over a year now, as many of us have, and I suspect that's had something to do with goings-on behind the scenes (system changes like this don't happen overnight). My impressions plummeted from a constant 15K plus weekly to never more than 2K. Fortunately, I've had some time to get my backside into gear and secure other sources of income and clients. Had I not, then I'd be freaking out now because visibility is everything and that has suddenly become even more volatile on this platform. I'm not even bothering to think about new gigs. I might tweak my existing ones now and then, but attempting to expand here in my metric seems pointless. Fiverr orders for me have gone from an almost daily expectation to an occasional nice surprise. 

[edc_lab]

15 hours ago, carineb said:

They should also think about changing the answers and putting "Good" between "Average" and "Very good"!!!!

Hello! @visualstudios posted a link on that topic, they are using an asymmetric rating scale called Likert Scale.
So this is something applied on purpose and I doubt this going to be changed.

Basically, if I had a good experience purchasing a service, and I don't have the option to rate it as good, at that point, I will be more inclined to set "very good" instead of "average".
This means I'm selecting a 4-star rating and all the decimals added by the checklist are a sort of plus that brings the sellers closer to 5 instead of 3.

The system is trying to push more sellers in the 4.0 zone to tell the new potential Fiverr customers "Look at my sellers, look at their numbers, they are very good!".
It's also a way to influence customers that Fiverr has very good services, not just good.

[emmaki]

2 hours ago, leannelrivers said:

Same with some VO gigs. 

"I will record you a British accent voiceover."

"I will record you a voiceover in a British accent."

"British accent voiceover? I will record it."

"British female voiceover recorded for you."

"recorded for you: Female British voiceover."

"I'm female. I'm British. I record voiceover."

There is a VO seller who is flogging his services (off-Fiverr) as an expert who advises VOs to do this. Otherwise, his advice is pretty sound. But there's a whole cluster of VO artists who follow that advice... 

[emmaki]

Also, looking more closely at the Q4 report yesterday, Fiverr reckons AI is responsible for like 4% of its growth last year AND it is developing new proprietary AI stuff for use on the platform. 

It also explicitly mentioned "improving seller quality" and reducing marketing on "low value buyers". It's basically squeezing the lower end of the marketplace out very slowly and using AI to reinforce consistently high quality among sellers. Reading between the lines, it also looks like it will reward sellers who use AI in their gigs as a part of the service. Basically everything that talking water cooler ad of theirs said. 

There's quite a bit more of interest, but suffice to say, Fiverr isn't going to change how it uses AI on er, Fiverr. 

Also, despite PG being terribad, it resulted in an 80% increase in revenue. STOP USING PG IF YOU HATE IT. They will not make it any better if it makes $$$ in its current form. 

EDIT: it also said that AI had made things possible in ecom that were not possible before. It didn't specify exactly what things those were, but it could be the current AI ranking system, as they did say on one of the webinar slides (I think - I posted them on P1 of this thread) that our current/old rankings aren't quite gelling with reality. So I'm thinking the AI is key there)

Meanwhile, in my inbox, a buyer demands samples, not quite trusting that I was really an English writer (a quick look at his buying history explained everything). I direct them to my portfolio and gigs, which have around 40-45 sample between them... 

Needless to say, that was a no from me. The "not in control" line was particularly worrying... 

Edited February 23 by emmaki

[edc_lab]

38 minutes ago, emmaki said:

Needless to say, that was a no from me. The "not in control" line was particularly worrying... 

Do you wanna know my technique for spotting red flags?

Quote

For me, choosing the right person to do dental care for my mouth is a headache because I do not know what to expect. Once I start the session, I am not in control of what is happening anymore.

Now imagine the dentist's reaction.

[carineb]

1 hour ago, edc_lab said:

they are using an asymmetric rating scale called Likert Scale.

My first lesson on the Likert scale dates back over 25 years ago when I was studying marketing 😉

The responses absolutely do not adhere to what a Likert scale is! There are thousands of examples of Likert scales on the internet. You won't find any that don't have balanced responses that are antonyms (exact opposite)!

Few examples: 
Strongly disagree - Disagree - Neither agree or disagree - Agree - Strongly agree
Never - Almost never - Occasionally/Sometimes - Almost every time - Every time
Very difficult - Difficult - Neutral - Easy - Very easy
Very dissatisfied - Dissatisfied - Unsure - Satisfied - Very satisfied

Fiverr claims transparency, fighting against fraud and honesty. Deciding to bias a satisfaction questionnaire and discreetly lowering "very good" from 5 to 4 stars without reducing the rating to maintain one's level goes against these values.

For several days now, I've been wondering how to obtain 5 stars for my translation service into French. A translation is never "exceptional"! So, I'll likely end up with 4 stars for this service (which is my biggest gig). Consequently, I'll delete or pause it. Clients will then have plenty of options among all the Google translators claiming fluency in 10 languages!
The empire of poor-quality work... 🤐

 

[stepanc]

Hi guys,

I have a suggestion for you all:

Since Fiverr now also locks the topics in the forum, I think it would be very useful for us to connect somehow differently. I think that those who are not enthusiastic about the new level system should have the opportunity to exchange ideas. Do you have any ideas? Another forum? A messenger?

Maybe we can also work out some constructive suggestions for Fiverr or start some COMMON action. Because Fiverr can ignore every single person, but not a certain number of dissatisfied people.

We can continue to discuss here but connect elsewhere for the worst case.

[abeljimenez271]

I find it incredible that after all the negative feedback that Fiverr is receiving, the only thing they do is to close a thread....

I am totally disappeared from the search results for having a 4 in success score (negative impact in Effective communication), despite having everything perfect. 

This is hopeless 😞

[visualstudios]

2 hours ago, edc_lab said:

posted a link on that topic, they are using an asymmetric rating scale called Likert Scale.

That's not what I said. What I said is that they should be using a Likert scale, and they indeed use it for their own surveys (CS for example), but they are deliberately not using it for seller ratings, which is evidently unfair and skewed.

[priyank_mod]

29 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

That's not what I said. What I said is that they should be using a Likert scale, and they indeed use it for their own surveys (CS for example), but they are deliberately not using it for seller ratings, which is evidently unfair and skewed.

I'm just responding like devil's advocate here...🙈 

But their staff doesn't try to manipulate the ratings given to them by sellers but many here will cross 7 seas and slay dragons to manipulate the system!! 😏

[visualstudios]

8 minutes ago, priyank_mod said:

But their staff doesn't try to manipulate the ratings given to them by sellers but many here will cross 7 seas and slay dragons to manipulate the system!!

Their staff is on a salary. If CS made $0 a month if people were unhappy, they would have all died of hunger by now. It's very easy to not care about a bad review if it doesn't hit you in your pocket directly.

[priyank_mod]

15 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

Their staff is on a salary. If CS made $0 a month if people were unhappy, they would have all died of hunger by now. It's very easy to not care about a bad review if it doesn't hit you in your pocket directly.

I concur, this thought had also crossed my mind. And, perhaps they function in a more controlled and regulated environment too (with their appraisals and variable salary components being tied to their ratings)

But bad apples on our side give everyone a bad name. So many of us have repeatedly mentioned that we are tired of being seen with suspicion all the time or being punished for anything and everything which goes wrong under the sun!! 🧐

The moment they make our evaluation more quantifiable & transparent, people will jump to manipulate it!! 🥲

[thebrownie]

Hello fellow Fiverr community members and the Fiverr team,

 

I hope this message finds you well. I've taken the time to understand the recent updates to the level system, and while I appreciate Fiverr's efforts to refine and improve the platform, I have some concerns regarding how these changes might inadvertently affect certain types of gigs, particularly those with higher pricing and projects that naturally require more time for completion.

 

Impact on High-Priced Gigs: It has come to my attention that the new metric system may disproportionately penalize gigs with higher pricing. These gigs, often associated with specialized services that necessitate extensive effort and expertise, are vital to the ecosystem. The higher price point reflects the quality and depth of work involved. However, under the new system, it seems these gigs might be at a disadvantage due to their pricing structure, which could inadvertently discourage the offering of high-value, specialized services on the platform.

 

Deadline Flexibility for Time-Intensive Projects: Another point of concern is the handling of deadlines for projects that inherently require more time, sometimes due to the complexity of the work and other times due to evolving client needs. It's not uncommon for clients to request extensions or modifications that extend the original timeline. While these requests are often reasonable and part of a collaborative process leading to higher client satisfaction, the new system's rigid metric on deadlines could penalize sellers for accommodating client wishes, thereby potentially discouraging a flexible and client-focused approach.

 

I believe the diversity of gigs offered on Fiverr—including those at higher price points and those requiring more time—adds significant value to the platform, enabling clients to find bespoke solutions tailored to their needs. To ensure that Fiverr remains a competitive and attractive platform for both buyers and sellers, I propose the following considerations:

 

Introduce Flexibility for High-Value Gigs: Consider metrics that can differentiate between standard and high-value gigs, recognizing the unique aspects and challenges of the latter. This differentiation could help ensure that sellers offering specialized services are not unfairly penalized under the new system.

Adjust Deadline Metrics to Account for Client-Requested Extensions: Implementing a system where deadline extensions requested by clients do not negatively impact the seller's metrics could encourage a more collaborative and flexible approach to project completion.

I am eager to hear the thoughts of other community members and the Fiverr team on these points. My intention is to spark a constructive dialogue that leads to solutions benefiting the entire Fiverr community. Thank you for considering this feedback and for your ongoing efforts to improve the platform.

 

Warm regards,

thebrownie - Florian K

[edc_lab]

1 hour ago, carineb said:

You won't find any that don't have balanced responses that are antonyms (exact opposite)!

34 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

That's not what I said. What I said is that they should be using a Likert scale, and they indeed use it for their own surveys (CS for example), but they are deliberately not using it for seller ratings, which is evidently unfair and skewed.

My bad! I thought the Likert Scale was the unbalanced one, like "this not linear technique needs a name". For me, the classic "very bad, bad, neutral, good, very good" is just... the normal one! Probably the huge amount of messages on Kesha's topic didn't help me understand your message clearly so sorry both of you for my mistake.
I hope you understand.

[rad_graphic]

This review system is directly hitting our stomachs. Fiverr is my only income. I rely on Fiverr for everything. This is just bad. 

[thebrownie]

Thank you frank, check out my feedback on the new system

Feedback on the New Level System: Concerns About High-Priced Gigs and Deadline Flexibility etc.

[thebrownie]

6 minutes ago, rad_graphic said:

This review system is directly hitting our stomachs. Fiverr is my only income. I rely on Fiverr for everything. This is just bad. 

I feel this very much it is also for me my 80% income

[emmaki]

1 hour ago, stepanc said:

Hi guys,

I have a suggestion for you all:

Since Fiverr now also locks the topics in the forum, I think it would be very useful for us to connect somehow differently. I think that those who are not enthusiastic about the new level system should have the opportunity to exchange ideas. Do you have any ideas? Another forum? A messenger?

Maybe we can also work out some constructive suggestions for Fiverr or start some COMMON action. Because Fiverr can ignore every single person, but not a certain number of dissatisfied people.

We can continue to discuss here but connect elsewhere for the worst case.

Have you.... looked at the other Fiverr-related forums on the internet lately? It's either spam, gurus, or complaints from people who have no intention of doing anything other than emigrating to the greener grass of another platform after a screech about what a poophole Fiverr is. 

There is very little sense of community among the majority of Fiverr sellers, unless that community is united against Fiverr (the old us v them paradigm). And even then, the community is divided in two between "serious" sellers and a whole marketplace of fraudsters, buyers and sellers. If this update gets rid of the majority (or at least a lot) of those types, then.... I'm for the changes, even if it might cost me 0.3 stars because of silly metrics like value for money. 

There is no common action to be had. The workers are too divided to even carry out the most basic of action against corporates: the downing of tools - and there are many sellers who simply do not care about this beyond how it impacts their ability to make more orders. In the end, sellers hurt themselves far more than Fiverr ever could - what difference will making yet another community, splintering existing ones further, make?

Who will come? The kind of sellers Fiverr wants to keep, or the kind of sellers Fiverr wants to lose?  Because if it's the latter, Fiverr won't listen - and the kind of seller Fiverr wants to keep doesn't generally waste their time fannying around on internet talkboards like the us mouthy slobs. 

 

[emmaki]

34 minutes ago, priyank_mod said:

The moment they make our evaluation more quantifiable & transparent, people will jump to manipulate it!! 

If only Fiverr would just hire more people to crack down on the actual problem sellers. As it is, I suppose we all have to be on our A-game from now, RTO-ing everything to keep tight QC control over who we allow to work with us. 

I found a post on a forum the other week (it was quite old, maybe from 2015) of some guy from you-know-where who was running 10 accounts and had his 12-year-old nephew doing "very easy work" making 2k a month despite awful stats. This is pre-levels when stats didn't really matter. Maybe it was a pile of BS from someone trying to guru their way to internet $, but all the usual suspects were gobbling it up.

It immediately struck me how different it used to be. Except it isn't, really. Everything got a little harder, so everything just got a little more sophisticated. I don't see how anything except heavy-handed human verification of everything can really solve the issue, and we all know that's not how Fiverr is going to do it.

Heavy-handed AI it is then - but I do think they should at least expand their CS and T&S departments to better handle the frequent culls of thousands of sellers because the AI misfired. 

 

[leonormiserol]

Finally CS got tired of me.

After pressuring them for several days to respond to me because my gig is marked by "cancellations" giving me a score of 4. When I only have these 3 cancellations! And they are from a long time ago.
It should be noted that 2 were frequent clients, who unfortunately asked for additional changes and then regretted it because they didn't like it, and instead of appreciating the work they decided to cancel. The other was because he asked for excess work after having agreed to a minimum change.

My success manager hasn't responded to me in over a week. There is definitely nothing he can do. All of this is very unfair and contradictory. Since they say they take recent orders into account.

I write this only to express my frustration and resignation at starting at level 0 without just cause. I know it doesn't contribute anything to help others, but if there is anyone else in the same situation, know that you are not alone.

 

[virgoca]

2 minutes ago, leonormiserol said:

[carineb]

1 hour ago, visualstudios said:

they should be using a Likert scale, and they indeed use it for their own surveys (CS for example), but they are deliberately not using it for seller ratings, which is evidently unfair and skewed.

Unfair, skewed... Yes! But it doesn't seem to bother anyone at Fiverr!

The most bizarre aspect of this review system is that the client never actually assigns stars. They just click on smileys, and somehow, it all magically converts into stars in the end!

Furthermore I wonder how and why Fiverr decided that a smiley with a big smile is worth 4 stars. Everywhere else, the small smile is worth 4 stars and the big smile is worth 5 stars. The smiley of the guy with red stars in his eyes after abusing illegal substances doesn't exist anywhere else in evaluation scales!

If Fiverr wants to transform smileys into stars, they must do it in a TRANSPARENT way. There are plenty of really cool designs for smileys with stars.

Edited February 23 by carineb