Official feedback thread re: the new leveling system

[datadriven_ads]

On 2/22/2024 at 8:39 PM, frank_d said:

Hey gang.

Since @Kesha locked the official news thread, I felt like it was valid for us to create a new thread on this section of the forum, so we can gather our questions, concerns and feedback on the new system.

Let's please refrain from actually asking for support for our personal accounts, anyone who needs immediate assistance should open an official ticket with CS instead.

 

This thread is for sellers, members of this community, to openly ask questions, express opinions and discuss their issues or concerns around the new leveling system.

 

I will try to keep this thread open but I will also do my best to ensure off-topic replies and requests for support are hidden, so we can keep things clean.

 

 

Thank you so much for sharing this valiable information. 

[donnovan86]

8 hours ago, bahar_moradi said:

I found many duplicated gigs in search results. My account fell after this update and I don't get even a single message. I reported this to CS.

 

Those are not duplicated gigs. It's a single gig. One of them is an Ad for that gig via promoted gigs. That's why you sometimes see the same thing twice, because that person also uses promoted gigs to promote their service via an ad.... 

[cucinavivace]

1 hour ago, donnovan86 said:

Those are not duplicated gigs. It's a single gig. One of them is an Ad for that gig via promoted gigs. That's why you sometimes see the same thing twice, because that person also uses promoted gigs to promote their service via an ad.... 

Amazon and all the rest do the same thing. Here are the "sponsored" ones and here are the search results sorted by relevance. It always ends up with someone who's near the top anyway also showing in the paid list, which I suppose is not a coincidence and in a way is the whole point. If they took that guy near the top out of the regular search because he was right above it in the paid search, we'd all yell and scream that many people skim right by the paid listings (I know I do).  

[bahar_moradi]

Please anyone can help me? Why my success score of gig is 4 ? I didn't have any dispute until now. .

[rudyabel]

I just had a 3 day relay race with CS. I don't feel like I spoke to a real Human in the whole time. I just got passed from "person" to "person". Feeding me the same 3 lines over and over again as if I didn't make a relevant point. 
It's been 8 months.  
Whatever infraction that has be issued should be resolved by now. I asked them initially if I should give up. Look at my account. Do I have a real future with the company? They tap danced around this like Fred Astaire. Ultimately giving me no information on my status. Applauding my record. And saying leaving is my prerogative if I so choose. Never really answering the question. If I actually paid money for a SP session, it would be just as nebulous. 
My gig has crashed almost below new seller exposure. I am a TRS with a 9 over all rating. There is no reason I or others at our level should be seeing these low numbers for this long.

What's the point of achieving anything on fiverr if it doesn't matter and won't count?

I've had talks with people who were once preferred, see their 6 digit business buckle to 25% of it's previous exposure. Relying on repeat customers almost exclusively.
Another that nearly lost it all, permanently, if not for a near class action of people coming out of every corner to press SP/CS to reinstate this long time beloved figure. The rest of us don't have that kind of pull. 
Where you can say to a less prolific seller that they are just "being unreasonable". You cannot say the same to the people who have achieved great success and now are getting trampled underfoot too.  One is "bellyaching" the other is darkly systemic. 

Is Fiverr over?

 

Edited June 2 by rudyabel

[donnovan86]

2 hours ago, cucinavivace said:

But why would they lie and leave tips and come back to pay me again? It's BS.

Well, they also compare our gigs to others in the niche. And when it comes to private feedback, there are multiple options, not just good or bad. So it might be that. 

[ch6k0r]

Since success score compares us to other sellers with similar aspects and niches, what are the factors that are being compared and how do I change who am I compared to? example: If I lower my price will I be compared to people with a lower rate? and vice versa.
I work on an artistic field (Music) and art is very subjective when it comes to comparisons and competitivity.
And by the way after the removale of promoted gigs, lately I get no orders and it was my only way of fixing my score one day (even if my score doesn't seem to move after +50 orders)

Edited June 4 by ch6k0r

[donnovan86]

4 hours ago, ch6k0r said:

how do I change who am I compared to? example: If I lower my price will I be compared to people with a lower rate? and vice versa.

Fiverr won't say most likely. But I assume you are compared with people within your category. I don't think pricing matters, the category matters. 

[ch6k0r]

1 hour ago, donnovan86 said:

Fiverr won't say most likely. But I assume you are compared with people within your category. I don't think pricing matters, the category matters. 

Thanks man, I apreciate the amount of smart opinions that you've provided on this thread

[priyank_mod]

6 hours ago, ch6k0r said:

Thanks man, I apreciate the amount of smart opinions that you've provided on this thread

To my limited understanding - its the sheer number of orders a seller delivers and the average time frame for each order. (let's say on a weekly basis)

PS given that those orders don't receive bad public and/or private ratings. 

This is the REASON why agency accounts masquerading as single sellers are winning this game. 

Edited June 5 by priyank_mod

[rawque_gulia]

7 hours ago, ch6k0r said:

I don't think pricing matters,

9 hours ago, donnovan86 said:

Fiverr won't say most likely. But I assume you are compared with people within your category. I don't think pricing matters, the category matters. 

Fiverr definitely considers pricing when comparing you with your competitors. Of course, it won't compare a $5 seller with a $500 seller. This has already been confirmed by Customer Support today when I reached out to them regarding a cancellation query.

Source: Customer Support

Edited June 5 by rawque_gulia

[donnovan86]

2 hours ago, priyank_mod said:

This is the REASON why agency accounts masquerading as single sellers are winning this game. 

In the writing section there's a Pro seller which in an online interview said she has over 100 employees. Yet on their profile page, it's "me", "I" will write, etc. That's obviously unfair and they manage to generate a massive income and tons of profit, most likely that seller never writes anything, they just receive, share the guidelines and manage the reviews, etc. And we are compared to that person, and many others that do the same, most likely. That's unfair. 

[donnovan86]

1 hour ago, rawque_gulia said:

Of course, it won't compare a $5 seller with a $500 seller.

Well it would be for the best to keep such a comparison. But again, lack of transparency when it comes to the price bracket. What are the price brackets, $5-$100 or $5-$10?  There's no info, so you don't know. They might very well compare everyone regardless of the price and we would not know. 

[rawque_gulia]

26 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

There's no info, so you don't know. They might very well compare everyone regardless of the price and we would not know.

To be honest, it's best that the info is hidden -- otherwise, the entire marketplace will go into trash. Everyone will start downgrading their prices to fit those brackets to avoid any competition with high-level/high-priced sellers.

It's best for us that certain aspects of the algorithm remain untransparent (to keep the entire ecosystem balanced).

29 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

They might very well compare everyone regardless of the price and we would not know. 

I think you missed the second part of my message. Yes, they have not revealed the price brackets, but they have certainly confirmed that they take prices into consideration. So, saying that "they compare everyone regardless of the price" directly contradicts customer support's statement (which knows better than us), I guess.

[donnovan86]

10 minutes ago, rawque_gulia said:

It's best for us that certain aspects of the algorithm remain untransparent (to keep the entire ecosystem balanced).

The sheer fact that we know we are compared with outsourcers makes this very messy, and outsourcers take advantage of that by getting even more orders, while others don't.  

10 minutes ago, rawque_gulia said:

Yes, they have not revealed the price brackets, but they have certainly confirmed that they take prices into consideration.

I didn't miss anything. I saw that, but I don't trust the statement based on my personal findings and scouting of the marketplace. 

[rawque_gulia]

1 hour ago, donnovan86 said:

The sheer fact that we know we are compared with outsourcers makes this very messy, and outsourcers take advantage of that by getting even more orders, while others don't.  

Completely agree! Even for the algorithm, it wouldn't be difficult to identify who is working as an individual and who is working as an agency. Honestly, it already knows that! If 90% of people are delivering an average of 1 logo per day, and on the other hand, others are delivering 20 logos per day, it's clear that those are outsourcing the work.

Fiverr should definitely consider this while comparing us with those agencies.

1 hour ago, donnovan86 said:

I didn't miss anything. I saw that, but I don't trust the statement based on my personal findings and scouting of the marketplace. 

Still not sure what the solid reason for this is. No customer support will provide wrong information, so contradicting their statement (who knows internally how the algorithm functions) by us (who are just assuming things) doesn't add up! But yeah, everyone is welcome to share their point of view!

[donnovan86]

1 hour ago, rawque_gulia said:

But yeah, everyone is welcome to share their point of view!

It's not the first time when a success manager said one thing and customer support said the opposite. That's why I take things with a grain of salt. 

[cucinavivace]

1 hour ago, rawque_gulia said:

No customer support will provide wrong information, so contradicting their statement (who knows internally how the algorithm functions) by us (who are just assuming things) doesn't add up! 

 

Oh, Fiverr customer support provides the wrong information all the time. I've had them tell me the wrong timeframe to leave a review, the wrong timeframe for a customer to complain and ask for a refund, the wrong eligibility for early withdrawals, the wrong eligibility for promoted gigs, the wrong information on public ratings duration, the wrong information on subscription cancellations ...

A couple weeks ago I had a complicated situation with a buyer on a subscription and wanted to block him from buying from me again. A CS rep told me that blocking a buyer only blocks them in the inbox. I had to send her their own documentation saying that if a buyer has a completed order with you, blocking is supposed to completely block them from your profile. I never got a response.

I'm not saying it's wrong this time. That "relative to other sellers" bit is a cut and paste from the gig score documentation, not even that rep's personal response. But assuming CS's information is gospel at all times is definitely misplaced faith.

Edited June 5 by cucinavivace

[tosindev]

I think mid May 2024 I got back to level 2 with my success score of my main gig increased from 6 to 7, but other metrics inside is still confusing, hardly anything concrete to backtrack what I did better. This system is very discouraging. I'm going to try messaging CS again.

[filipdevaere]

59 minutes ago, thateamltd said:

Ooo this post very helpful for me

Did you read the 65 pages?

[smartdezigns]

1 minute ago, thateamltd said:

Yes of course

Could you please summarize everything in few points so that I can understand what actually has been discussed here? 

[hamingtone]

first of all thank you guys for talking about the new leveling system, i have been frustrated and immensly stressed after the new succes score update because it confirms that the platform is completely out of touch with its sellers, rather than promoting growth and rewarding loyalty and good work you get a shot in the foot

5 stars reviews no longer matter, even if a costumer is satisfied with the work and leaves a tip on top doesnt matter either, repeat costumers dont seem to matter either, but god forbid if you get a revision you go from top seller to rockbottom,

finally as sellers i feel like our work and contribution to the platform is futile since growth in this kind of enviroment is near impossible, this only makes me want to take my services else where rather than improve and do "better"

[rudyabel]

Quiet firing describes how managers fail to adequately provide coaching, support and career development to an employee, which results in pushing the employee out of an organization.

In a worst-case scenario, quiet firing happens when managers allow employees to have truly toxic or miserable experiences at work as a way to squeeze them out. It's a form of gaslighting.

And while this may be a common practice in today's workplace, it isn't good leadership, productive or the right thing to do. At the very least, it tarnishes your employer's reputation as a good place to work, poisons team trust and can even hurt your ability to keep customers happy when key employees exit.

Get accustomed to this term. It is happening here right now. 

[donnovan86]

1 hour ago, rudyabel said:

Get accustomed to this term. It is happening here right now. 

We are not Fiverr employees though. We are contractors, and this is just a platform where we present services. Just because we sell stuff on Craigslist, that doesn't make us Craigslist employees. It's pretty much the same thing, the only difference is that Fiverr is a freelancing platform. But it's not like we are employed by them, Kesha and other team members are employees, we are just third party contractors. 

[dponzio]

29 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

We are not Fiverr employees though. We are contractors, and this is just a platform where we present services. Just because we sell stuff on Craigslist, that doesn't make us Craigslist employees. It's pretty much the same thing, the only difference is that Fiverr is a freelancing platform. But it's not like we are employed by them, Kesha and other team members are employees, we are just third party contractors. 

That being true, I wonder why then we are subject to certain forms of pressure and obligations that in certain countries (like mine) are not legal if you are not an employee? Pretty the same happened with the food delivery providers - the EU has sanctioned certain forms of abuse of free contracting. https://www.politico.eu/article/italy-demands-733-million-euros-in-fines-from-food-delivery-platforms/ ; https://www.euronews.com/next/2021/12/08/gig-economy-eu-prepares-new-rules-which-could-hit-uber-and-deliveroo ; https://www.politico.eu/article/uber-future-uk-court-ruling-workers-rights-protections/ ; 

Edited June 12 by dponzio
adding one more informative link