Official feedback thread re: the new leveling system

[donnovan86]

1 hour ago, cucinavivace said:

No disrespect intended, but that all seems very far afield from the post on "somehow one 5 star rating and one with no rating, but from a client she's sure did not leave negative private feedback, total two orders, equals a gig score of 6," which was all I guessed at possible reasons for.

I didn't even see you replied someone, I thought you made a general statement. Regardless, there's so much private data and stuff we don't know that Fiverr takes into account at this point.. that I am sure no one has any clear idea of how this system works. Which is what I think Fiverr wants in the first place anyway. 

I had a gig with a success score of 10. I had no orders and just a single person self-promoted their service, I said Hi and then blocked them. No other interaction with that gig from me or any buyer, no sales, no messages. It dropped to SS 9 and then 8. Reason: Communication is seen as negative. So that alone shows me that the system is broken and I just don't really care about figuring things out, because it just makes you mad without bringing a proper solution. I know they compare it with others from the niche, but it doesn't say it might be due to that. Just negative impact from Communication, which is random because I tend to reply much much faster than the average seller here and always keep things civil. 

[cucinavivace]

12 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

I didn't even see you replied someone, I thought you made a general statement.

Well that explains it then. Thanks!

[mandyzines]

6 hours ago, cucinavivace said:

They don't like it when buyers leave no review. I do not have proof,

I also have no proof but too think that no review is not a good indicator to their fancy algorithms. This is backed by a recent, awkward forum post by staff encouraging us to prod clients for reviews. I think it's known how much it messes with scores.

[cucinavivace]

2 minutes ago, mandyzines said:

I also have no proof but too think that no review is not a good indicator to their fancy algorithms. This is backed by a recent, awkward forum post by staff encouraging us to prod clients for reviews. I think it's known how much it messes with scores.

I didn't want to offer it as anything definitive, but since all this started if I have a delivered order waiting for acceptance or feedback, I get no more inbox inquiries. I can get three or four people a day sending me messages via inbox proving I'm visible, and the minute I deliver an order it all stops. My last order the guy didn't even accept the delivery, no feedback. I haven't had an inquiry since then. Six days.

The guy just kept chatting with me via inbox after delivery, since that order page is such a pain in the rear to message on. He was happy enough, but never indicated that by accepting delivery and rating. So, here I sit.

Now mind you, I am a lowly level 1 at this point. Perhaps if I were level 2 again it wouldn't. I have no idea. But it's happened exactly this way on every order since the new system went in. If a delivery or feedback is pending, zippo.

[mandyzines]

15 minutes ago, cucinavivace said:

 

We can't help but notice patterns and look for more when things are opaque. I'm level 2 and Top Rated evaluation-qualified--as of today, anyway. I've gone through similar cycles.

[sshublaq]

17 hours ago, cucinavivace said:

They don't like it when buyers leave no review

THIS THIS THIS

[donnovan86]

11 hours ago, cucinavivace said:

I can get three or four people a day sending me messages via inbox proving I'm visible, and the minute I deliver an order it all stops.

For me it's the opposite. Generally I receive inquiries after I deliver orders. Otherwise, if I am not delivering anything, there are no messages. So my experience is vastly different. 

[kyiviter]

18 hours ago, cucinavivace said:

They don't like it when buyers leave no review.

Yes, and instead of making review mandatory for buyers, they decided that sellers should force buyers to give feedback)

Edited May 2 by kyiviter

[donnovan86]

53 minutes ago, sshublaq said:

THIS THIS THIS

When I talked with my success manager a while ago about this specific thing, she told me that ideally I should encourage people to leave a review. She told me that if you don't have a review it won't have a negative impact, however having reviews is better not only for the profile, but it might help ranking. 

Obviously, Fiverr wants to feed the AI data in order for it to rank you properly. And based on my experience, I have around half or more orders not getting any reviews, and I don't feel penalized because impressions and clicks are either stable or improving. 

54 minutes ago, kyiviter said:

they decided that sellers should force buyers to give feedback

You don't have to force anyone. As I said, they do encourage the idea of having reviews because it helps you with ranking. If you don't have reviews, obviously people won't know how your work is and what type of value you deliver. Plus, Fiverr can't acquire any data. 

[mandyzines]

On 4/30/2024 at 8:57 AM, mandyzines said:

I have a new gig with only two orders that now shows a success score of 6.

One order was from a client who never leaves reviews but always comes back to me. The other client left a long, glowing public review.

My main score's holding at 9, for now, maybe, maybe not.

Uncertainty and the opaqueness of this system's the best thing, ever.

So, today it's showing what might have dragged that score down: effective communication. I'm certain AI read our conversation wrong, because being prompt and polite with clients is not something that I have a problem with (and very much confirmed to not be the case in their public review).

I ask for vocal directions within my buyer requirement form, indicating that I specifically need details regarding emotion. The client just pasted what their client originally gave them in terms of articulation and pacing, as well as it needing to be "emotional." 

In a very lighthearted and polite way, I asked for what was left out of the form: details about emotions.

Their response was: "I thought I had said emotional." (Is that the dagger, Fiverr AI? BAD BOT!)

I shared an emotion wheel with them hoping that maybe the end client (a "ten year marketing veteran") could explain the specific emotions they wanted. My client was super happy about me sharing this resource with them and appreciated my humor in the matter.

"You are fantastic! Thank you so much for showing that? Yes, emotional is very broad lol."

"I love the way you are directing all of it!"

But, no further details were given by the end client, that delivery clock was ticking, and I knew that I had included one full revision with the order. So, I worked with what I had and delivered the order before the 12 hour mark.

"I listened to your voice over and love it! I will send it the client for approval and let you know if there is any change by Monday or Tuesday. Thank you so much!"

"Good morning (my client's name)! That’s fantastic! I’m glad that you like it. I’ll be here if you need me."

Of course, the rest is outside of the order chat but...

...the order autocompleted. I immediately notified them that I'd be available and would honor that revision for up to two weeks post delivery.

A week and a half later, my client came back.

Rather than explaining the emotions in words, the end client (a "10 year marketing veteran") recorded and sent me their interpretation of an "emotional" read of their script. Awesome-ish. The end client then felt so very involved, and even though I didn't hear anything but pride in the read I stated that I was going to copy it exactly in terms of word inflection, pauses, and even overall (higher, nasally) pitch. 

And, that's exactly what I did.

"You are AMAZING! I am so grateful to have found you. Thank you so much for the kind words!! The client seems to be very happy but will meet me next Monday, so I will keep you updated."

Then, I received a glowing public review.

## ##

Where's that bot? I want it in my dungeon! See how THAT feels!

All kidding aside, this is absolute bovine dung.

 

 

Edited May 3 by mandyzines

[donnovan86]

6 hours ago, mandyzines said:

Where's that bot? I want it in my dungeon! See how THAT feels!

 

Aside from what you said, I will also mention that if you don't have the last reply, it will also be seen as negative communication. 

I had a message saying "thank you" from the customer and Fiverr was showing in my dashboard as "waiting for reply". I ignored that, because obviously there's nothing else to say, other than artificially prolong the discussion. But yeah, a day and a half after that customer sent their message, I had negative impact on communication. So communication-wise, things are very weird and unless you reply right away or you know exactly what words you need to use, you might end up with your communication score damaged one way or another.

[priyank_mod]

11 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

I had a message saying "thank you" from the customer and Fiverr was showing in my dashboard as "waiting for reply".

Yes, seen this notification a few times in last 1 year or so but for me this ONLY happens when a buyer asks a question or leaves an enquiry of any kind on the order page. But if buyer's last reply was neutral or happy - then system doesn't demand a reply from us!! 

I feel system specifically looks for "question mark" or sentences starting with "what/why/how/when".

Yesterday a buyer left me a few youtube links of videos he wanted me to check and choose from. And one text just said - "what do you think about this one? will this fit the narrative?" 

And this order's section on dashboard had the notification blaring and screaming at me for ignoring the buyer for 11 hours!! 😂

[travellogra]

I think sometimes you have to give an off to run something as it was going smoothly. Too much development could spread the negative development, that is happening right now with fiverr. I think success score thing was way more unnecessary thing to be introduced in.

Fiverr should work on increasing the good working environment for the sellers here, because I think Top-Rated sellers are working with huge order aspects. whereas, fiverr should work on to make the sellers easy working ways and also keep the buyers attach to it. So than the business between buyers and sellers will grow. Just by pressurizing the sellers to give 200% will not solve the issue, it will make it worse. 

[donnovan86]

3 hours ago, priyank_mod said:

 But if buyer's last reply was neutral or happy - then system doesn't demand a reply from us!! 

Well that was the only communication I had since the new success system was added for that particular gig, and it dropped from 10 in score to 8, the only issue being shown is with communication. So make of that what you will 🙂

[mrnikp]

IHMO, someone is going to be in trouble if they haven't already. this new scoring system is someone's brain child and they are going to be in deep trouble because as of still today Fiverr stock share have been tanking since the announcement of the new system. How long will it be before this experiment is over?

[rudyabel]

40 minutes ago, mrnikp said:

IHMO, someone is going to be in trouble if they haven't already. this new scoring system is someone's brain child and they are going to be in deep trouble because as of still today Fiverr stock share have been tanking since the announcement of the new system. How long will it be before this experiment is over?

In PTCs like this. They only can only go so cheap until somebody swoops in and buys them. Microsoft? Google? Some big whale will come along eventually. This might have been all a half baked scheme to prevent it. Nope. 

[sabbirthedealer]

More things are waiting for everyone

[filipdevaere]

18 minutes ago, sabbirthedealer said:

More things are waiting for everyone

Explain us....

[cucinavivace]

On 5/3/2024 at 1:59 AM, donnovan86 said:

Aside from what you said, I will also mention that if you don't have the last reply, it will also be seen as negative communication. 

I had a message saying "thank you" from the customer and Fiverr was showing in my dashboard as "waiting for reply". I ignored that, because obviously there's nothing else to say, other than artificially prolong the discussion. But yeah, a day and a half after that customer sent their message, I had negative impact on communication. So communication-wise, things are very weird and unless you reply right away or you know exactly what words you need to use, you might end up with your communication score damaged one way or another.

Hahahahaha. I am so tired of finding new ways to say "Thank you!" and "My pleasure." so I have the last word in every conversation. I think it makes me look like some kind of narcissist in some of those chats.

"Thank you!"
"Oh and thank you too."
"It's been great."
"My pleasure."
"Ok see you next time."
"Ok."
" 🙂 "
" 🙂 "

I had one lady who did pretty much that for a long time, so I finally had to tell her "We can do this all day if you want, but Fiverr dings my reply rating if I don't reply last. So, I'm gonna have the last word no matter how long this goes! 😄 " She laughed but then she said "You seriously have to reply to every single message, even just a final thank you or these smilies? That's ridiculous." Yes. Yes it is.

[donnovan86]

40 minutes ago, cucinavivace said:

That's ridiculous." Yes. Yes it is.

It is. And the funny thing is that it won't be a problem all the time. But sometime it is. I think it has to do with the length of that person's last message. Because if the message is short, I saw it doesn't say "waiting for reply", but for a longer (yet single) sentence, it does. I do what you said, try to reply to everything, even if it does seem quite the issue. Some buyers know about this and don't just try to have the last word. But others do.. and that leads to conversations like the one you shared above :))

[cucinavivace]

5 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

It is. And the funny thing is that it won't be a problem all the time. But sometime it is. I think it has to do with the length of that person's last message. Because if the message is short, I saw it doesn't say "waiting for reply", but for a longer (yet single) sentence, it does. I do what you said, try to reply to everything, even if it does seem quite the issue. Some buyers know about this and don't just try to have the last word. But others do.. and that leads to conversations like the one you shared above :))

I stopped paying attention to whether or not it said waiting for a reply because I figure even if they don't flag it the timing of my reply still might count in my "average response time." Mine's under an hour from instant replies in longer conversations. Now it's just habit.

They used to have it in our stats, so I assumed it mattered there. But either way I figure it can't hurt for marketing. My nearest competitor's average reply time is 4 hours and I've had a couple buyers mention they picked me because they hoped they wouldn't have to wait long (like they just wanted an answer on depreciation while they were in the middle of doing their taxes or something).  I figured it's worth keeping it up.

[donnovan86]

12 minutes ago, cucinavivace said:

They used to have it in our stats, so I assumed it mattered there. But either way I figure it can't hurt for marketing.

I am pretty sure it's still factored into our stats and it matters quite a bit. And like you, I do the exact same, it became a habit over the years. People do value response time, I will say that I had people appreciating fast replies. I also had someone that expected instant replies, seeing the 1 hour response time. I was writing, trying to finish a larger order, and that person sent around 20+ messages in 10 minutes. In the last one I was already getting insulted that I am not deserving the Level 2 title and people that have higher levels on Fiverr should reply instantly. I apologized and told I couldn't help, you can imagine how difficult such a person would be to work with. I didn't stick around to find out :)))

[katakatica]

37 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

It is. And the funny thing is that it won't be a problem all the time. But sometime it is. I think it has to do with the length of that person's last message. Because if the message is short, I saw it doesn't say "waiting for reply", but for a longer (yet single) sentence, it does. I do what you said, try to reply to everything, even if it does seem quite the issue. Some buyers know about this and don't just try to have the last word. But others do.. and that leads to conversations like the one you shared above :))

I might be completely wrong (I've been wrong a lot lately, lol) but I've always assumed that if the AI (or whatever) perceives that the buyer is asking a question on the order page (or inbox) (so basically they end their message with a question mark) then we get the 'waiting for reply' bit AND get dinged if we don't reply on time. 

However, I've noticed that even on gigs where I did my best to communicate a lot in the order chat and never left a question unanswered) I have ineffective communication so... who knows. 

I've been told off by buyers for asking too many questions (even necessary ones) as well so it's hard to know if that's tied to it too. Like... ask the right amount of questions but also make sure they aren't annoyed but also reply immediately even if that's a bit weird sometimes...

I don't know.

I got 4 major tips recently out of like 7 orders delivered on and still seem to be losing impressions and clicks so I've just given up trying to 'get' it. 

[donnovan86]

8 minutes ago, katakatica said:

However, I've noticed that even on gigs where I did my best to communicate a lot in the order chat and never left a question unanswered) I have ineffective communication so... who knows. 

 

You might be right, that's something to consider. In my case, it was a sentence with a period at the end, not a question mark.. That only reinforces the idea of replying to all messages, because you never know..

[dponzio]

On 5/3/2024 at 7:59 AM, donnovan86 said:

Aside from what you said, I will also mention that if you don't have the last reply, it will also be seen as negative communication. 

I had a message saying "thank you" from the customer and Fiverr was showing in my dashboard as "waiting for reply". I ignored that, because obviously there's nothing else to say, other than artificially prolong the discussion. But yeah, a day and a half after that customer sent their message, I had negative impact on communication. So communication-wise, things are very weird and unless you reply right away or you know exactly what words you need to use, you might end up with your communication score damaged one way or another.

...and I bet this has to happen in the order page chat before it's closed? Crazy! Now I understand when such a "negative impact" on communication comes from in one of my gigs. Unbelievable. 🤔

Edited May 4 by dponzio