Fiverr 4.0 - Some thoughts on the current state of things

[donnovan86]

9 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

$320+ to $23

True, but that $300+ price was obviously a one time thing and not something sustainable. Wasn't that when AMC and Gamestop had stupid share prices too? If I remember correctly..

[visualstudios]

29 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

Wasn't that when AMC and Gamestop had stupid share prices too?

Not really, it was after that. GME was a short squeeze though, and AMC was a copycat. Nothing to do with Fiverr. What happened with Fiverr was that covid hit, and every remote related stock shot up. 

Edited June 4, 2023 by visualstudios

[donnovan86]

12 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

and every remote related stock shot up. 

Yeah, I agree. I didn't expect that huge price to last. I always thought that Fiverr's stock would stay within $20 to $30, with the potential to become more expensive as the company grows. But I am not a stock dude myself so.. 

[kendal1747]

On 6/4/2023 at 9:56 AM, kellystrategy said:

The other way, they couldn't care at all whether you ever work, because it's not the 10% that keeps their lights on, and your lights no longer matter

Well said and that is my exact sentiments in dealing with Upwork.

[webdev_haven]

On 3/20/2023 at 4:49 PM, uk1000 said:

Maybe they're doing it this way to make things easier to check or the system a bit simpler but if they want to give more importance to newer sellers or more recent stats (like they do with the stats shown on the dashboard for the last 60 days), would things be a bit better for them if there was more of a gradual roll-off? Like them slowly them reducing the weights given to things the more days in the past it happened? Like if an order created 60 days ago is given 100% weight and then when it gets to 61 days ago it's given 0% weight surely that's not really how it should work (it's likely not accurately taking into account seller performance really).

eg. with the current system they'd need to wait 60 days or whatever for a bad review to not take effect, but a better system might give about half as much weight to it when it gets to 30 days (so some similar gradual roll-off), so there'd be less of a jump/less waiting.

This makes so much sense. A gradual roll-off or should we call it ease-in should be implemented. There is no way an order 60 days ago and another 10 days ago would have somewhat the same effect on metrics. This is where discretion should come into play

[mb100]

On 6/4/2023 at 10:34 PM, donnovan86 said:

Yeah, I agree. I didn't expect that huge price to last. I always thought that Fiverr's stock would stay within $20 to $30, with the potential to become more expensive as the company grows. But I am not a stock dude myself so.. 

Correct. The 4y chart shows the undulations and the huge spike in the middle. If you bought in 2019 and sold in 2021 you'd have made a fortune. It's now (June 2023) back to slightly less than were it started its journey four years ago. Not actually in a healthy position as things stand. Greed and fear at work in the middle and what drives the stock markets!    

[mb100]

1 hour ago, mb100 said:

Correct. The 4y chart shows the undulations and the huge spike in the middle. If you bought in 2019 and sold in 2021 you'd have made a fortune. It's now (June 2023) back to slightly less than were it started its journey four years ago. Not actually in a healthy position as things stand. Greed and fear at work in the middle and what drives the stock markets!    

It was at its peak during the Covid/lockdown period. Everyone was at home and the online world was crazy at its peak. Now it's levels are slightly less than pre-Covid and more sustainable.

[tme2012]

Upwork reduced its fees for newcomers to keep them interested, but is clearly hurting for income, so they shoved the dagger into the revenue of people who have long-term, established relationships on the site. For a couple of years I was down to just one client on Upwork who I work for about 4-5 months a year writing reports. We passed the $10,000 barrier years ago, which was the mark previously where Upwork dropped their cut from 10% to 5%. They have since realized that taking 20% of the first $500 was slaughtering their model and caused a mass exodus from the site, so they've reversed that, but also reversed the 5% back up to 10% as of the end of this year, because they figured out that's where the consistent money is. If I make the same income this year that I did last year from that one job, Upwork's policy change will cost me $500.

Their cut is better than Fiverr's, but for all of Fiverr's spam problems, the Pro Plus program is still light years ahead of anything Upwork can offer. I've been truly active on Fiverr since 2019 and made double the money here that I've being on Upwork since 2013. 

[mb100]

19 hours ago, tme2012 said:

Upwork reduced its fees for newcomers to keep them interested, but is clearly hurting for income, so they shoved the dagger into the revenue of people who have long-term, established relationships on the site. For a couple of years, I was down to just one client on Upwork who I work for about 4-5 months a year writing reports. We passed the $10,000 barrier years ago, which was the mark previously where Upwork dropped their cut from 10% to 5%. They have since realized that taking 20% of the first $500 was slaughtering their model and caused a mass exodus from the site, so they've reversed that, but also reversed the 5% back up to 10% as of the end of this year, because they figured out that's where the consistent money is. If I make the same income this year that I did last year from that one job, Upwork's policy change will cost me $500.

Their cut is better than Fiverr's, but for all of Fiverr's spam problems, the Pro Plus program is still light years ahead of anything Upwork can offer. I've been truly active on Fiverr since 2019 and made double the money here that I've being on Upwork since 2013. 

So they've basically moved the goalposts in order to generate their revenue from customers. More favorable on the newbie side and penalized more for being established. 

I've been on Fiverr for more years than I care to remember.  I preferred their old ways of ranking and how they rewarded sellers fairly for hard work.  Not like now and their strange algorithm, which can turn against you quite quickly and turn a full-time into a part-time income.

[tme2012]

On 6/12/2023 at 3:18 AM, mb100 said:

So they've basically moved the goalposts in order to generate their revenue from customers. More favorable on the newbie side and penalized more for being established. 

I've been on Fiverr for more years than I care to remember.  I preferred their old ways of ranking and how they rewarded sellers fairly for hard work.  Not like now and their strange algorithm, which can turn against you quite quickly and turn a full-time into a part-time income.

What is the algorithm change? I"m curious because I had the worst 3 months I've been on FIverr (Feb-April) since joining in 2019 with no negative reviews or anything that seemed out of the ordinary. Would be really grateful to hear more about it!

[donnovan86]

12 minutes ago, tme2012 said:

What is the algorithm change? I"m curious because I had the worst 3 months I've been on FIverr (Feb-April) since joining in 2019 with no negative reviews or anything that seemed out of the ordinary. Would be really grateful to hear more about it!

Fiverr started focusing more on first time buyer reviews. So if someone is new to Fiverr or they buy from you for the first time, their private review weighs a lot more than a regular review. I am with you on this.. since February I've had the worst year on Fiverr. I am sure AI has a role to play here, but even then there are sellers with a dozen or dozens of orders in queue. 

[tme2012]

Thanks for that insight. How terribly depressing, though. Just another head scratcher, up there with "buyers can extend the review time but we're not going to tell you about it ... ever."

[mb100]

58 minutes ago, donnovan86 said:

Fiverr started focusing more on first time buyer reviews. So if someone is new to Fiverr or they buy from you for the first time, their private review weighs a lot more than a regular review. I am with you on this.. since February I've had the worst year on Fiverr. I am sure AI has a role to play here, but even then there are sellers with a dozen or dozens of orders in queue. 

That's me ruined sort of. As I don't seem to get any new inquiries or orders. All repeat buyers now, as Fiverr don't seem to feature my gigs in their "best seller" or "recommended" searches for some bizarre reason.  

[vickiespencer]

1 hour ago, tme2012 said:

I had the worst 3 months I've been on FIverr (Feb-April) since joining in 2019

I joined Fiverr in July 2017, and it took time to get my gigs rolling and earn money. Then in February of this year, it was like a tap had been turned down to a dribble, and my sales were very low until the end of May. I had medical issues at the end of April and surgery at the beginning of May. I had to go OOO for ten days, and my May income was negligible. Things are beginning to pick up now. 
During the slow months, my SPM said my stats looked great as far as she could see, but my BSR was a bit low. Thank goodness for regular buyers. They kept me afloat from February through April, but May could have been much better regarding contacts and income. Going OOO was what affected May, I am sure.  
Other sellers I chat with in DMs have also cited the same months for their downturn. It is too much of a coincidence not to be due to a new algorithm. 

[josephinegold]

Absolutely Do Not Agree with This Decision, Fiverr's New Policy Is Helpful for Fake Buyers & Gig Competitors Who Want to Decrease Profits on This Platform. We Absolutely Do Not Agree with This New Policy Fiverr Team Must Need to Take Action and Change This Policy, Please.

[mb100]

13 hours ago, josephinegold said:

Absolutely Do Not Agree with This Decision, Fiverr's New Policy Is Helpful for Fake Buyers & Gig Competitors Who Want to Decrease Profits on This Platform. We Absolutely Do Not Agree with This New Policy Fiverr Team Must Need to Take Action and Change This Policy, Please.

I don't either, as it's open to abuse. I still like the platform though and if you keep giving customers good service, things will sort themselves out going forward.  

[donnovan86]

2 hours ago, mb100 said:

things will sort themselves out going forward.  

That's the thing, a lot of people either harass buyers to get paid or they offer a cancellation to protect a high rating they have for their gigs. That leads to some buyers missing deadlines and losing way more money. So I am sure many buyers complained to Fiverr, and they are taking action. If you offer great service, there's nothing to worry. Of course there can be times when this might backfire even for the best sellers. But in the end, it will weed out a lot of bad sellers for sure. I am not sure when this new measure starts, most likely Monday or so, which means we are just a few days away from seeing cancellation reviews on the platform.

Apparently these cancellations will have their own tag, so people know it's from canceled orders. 

[josephinegold]

you are absolutely Right. And I also provide high-quality work always to my buyer on Fiverr. But my question is About how to Fight fake buyers who want free work then get a full refund and then give negative. and The 2nd question is How we fight with gig competitors because the policy is very helpful for our gig competitor who wants down our Fiverr account. Really Dipowinted this policy. If you don't like my question really apologize for this. thank you. Waiting for your positive replying Quote.

[donnovan86]

8 minutes ago, josephinegold said:

and The 2nd question is How we fight with gig competitors because the policy is very helpful for our gig competitor who wants down our Fiverr account.

A Fiverr representative said that buyers which also sell here won't be able to leave a review if the order is canceled.

[catwriter]

1 hour ago, donnovan86 said:

I am sure many buyers complained to Fiverr

Definitely. We've seen a bunch of buyers complaining on the forum, too, how their experience was horrible, how they've canceled the order, and how they were frustrated because they couldn't leave a review that reflected that experience; they complained that all those 5 star ratings were meaningless because everyone had them, and bad sellers were obviously protecting their rating by cancelling as soon as they realised that the buyer wasn't happy.

[donnovan86]

8 minutes ago, catwriter said:

they complained that all those 5 star ratings were meaningless because everyone had them, and bad sellers were obviously protecting their rating by cancelling as soon as they realised that the buyer wasn't happy.

Exactly. What happens here is that legit sellers suffer from bad sellers that overpromise and underdeliver, then they throw buyers under the bus and either cancel and waste their time or even take the money and run. Since there were many forum posts from buyers and maybe even more complains to customer support, I can see why Fiverr did this. I am sure they didn't do this to anger sellers, obviously.

Everyone has to gain, but then again there will also be unreasonable buyers that are hard to work with and which take advantage of people. If Fiverr has the seller's back in those situations, then hopefully it's ok. 

[donnovan86]

10 minutes ago, catwriter said:

they complained that all those 5 star ratings were meaningless because everyone had them

Soon that won't be the case.

[tme2012]

I hate hearing that other strong freelancers are struggling on a platform that has been so good to us on average, but it is sort of gratifying to hear that it's not just me. I had a really good May, but only because I actively sought work on other platforms again. My highest income in a month on Fiverr this year is lower than any single month on Fiverr for me than any month except one in 2022, and before that, any month since November 2020. I attributed the decline in more freelancers entering the market and fewer people having time for freelance projects as things largely return to normal post-COVID. It is very defeating to think that Fiverr itself has put mechanics in place to lower my optics after all the $$ I've made for them the past few years. I did get a "Fiverr's choice" designation on a gig the other day, but not sure that's actually done anything for me so far. 

[mb100]

2 hours ago, donnovan86 said:

That's the thing, a lot of people either harass buyers to get paid or they offer a cancellation to protect a high rating they have for their gigs. That leads to some buyers missing deadlines and losing way more money. So I am sure many buyers complained to Fiverr, and they are taking action. If you offer great service, there's nothing to worry. Of course there can be times when this might backfire even for the best sellers. But in the end, it will weed out a lot of bad sellers for sure. I am not sure when this new measure starts, most likely Monday or so, which means we are just a few days away from seeing cancellation reviews on the platform.

Apparently these cancellations will have their own tag, so people know it's from canceled orders. 

In all of the years on this platform, I can't remember harassing a buyer, as most of my gig promotions are 30+ days. So that doesn't apply to a few sellers due to the type of promotion they offer. I have tried to cancel a few orders in the past for the reason you mentioned above. Mainly due to the nature of buyer attitude. The level of service each seller offers is subjective, but if you do each job to the best of your ability and try to over-deliver then, that should be enough.

[donnovan86]

1 minute ago, mb100 said:

that should be enough.

You would be amazed what kind of "buyers" are on the platform. I had someone order from me just so .. let's say insult me, I won't write what they said. True, that was in the early days but still. I had other person that wanted me to promote their website where they were selling fake passports and IDs. So yeah, it depends on the niche, but you will find some very shady buyers. Writing gigs will certainly attract that kind of people, but they are not the only ones..