New update: Buyers will soon be able to quallifying canceled orders...but sellers won't?

[akhterlily]

I think Fiverr should be left out. Because day by day Fiverr is getting more and more complicated.😔

[visualstudios]

16 minutes ago, newsmike said:

That is the main reason why people are upset about this.

Disagree. The main reason people are upset with this is that it allows unreasonable buyers to leave unwarranted reviews on services we don't even offer, or that they didn't order. That's the problem.

[katakatica]

8 minutes ago, newsmike said:

I am fine with sellers reporting bad buyers. I see your point there. I am commenting on the large vocal group of people getting hysterical over the fact that buyers who were disappointed can review even after getting a refund. Many sellers try to use the cancel feature as a way to "sanitize" their poor deliveries from being public.  Essentially saying, "Here. I'll give you your money back because it prevents you from telling others how I performed." In essence a payoff. 

That is the main reason why people are upset about this. It no longer allows them to censor reviews that they don't like. It is nothing more complicated that that. Many prefer to refund occasionally and present a false history of 100% satisfied buyers merely because they bought off the bad reviewers.

I applaud Fiverr for not allowing such censorship of reviews, which is in essence allowing sellers to trick the system.

The seller can always respond to the review.  

I'm more concerned than upset (though perhaps that's what it might seem like.) I've had about 7 cancellations since last January, of which two were valid (well..sort of) and all the rest were either misaligned expectations AFTER an order was placed (e.g write more for what I paid', buyers disappearing before sending in details or people demanding something I do not write as it's too explicit for the site. I don't think I personally will be affected all that much. However, I am worried because humans are, well, humans and you never know what some people might do knowing that they still get to leave a review after cancellation. 

I've had people curse, harass, stalk, etc. me. I'm worried that this might be the source of more issues in the long run. 

That being said, with the specifications, it does seem like it might work. I can, however, understand why people might not agree with it. You don't have to be a bad seller to worry, you can be a pushover (like me, which I try to fight against, yes) or just on the cheaper side and target the wrong audience. 

Since private reviews exist though, I do think that our actual (non just public) performance is what matters, so I'm not sure if reviews on cancelled orders will really do that much since they seem to have the option to do so already, it's just hidden / private. 

We'll see what this change brings I guess. 

[newsmike]

3 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

Disagree. The main reason people are upset with this is that it allows unreasonable buyers to leave unwarranted reviews on services we don't even offer, or that they didn't order. That's the problem.

But that is a fact in business.  Go look at airline reviews, iPhone reviews, any real product reviews...It's all there, the good, the bad and the ugly. This idea that Fiverr sellers should live in a bubble free of criticism with a mechanism to censor unhappy buyers with a quick payoff is ridiculous.  There are no legitimate businesses with 100% positive reviews because it's fraud and fantasy, yet that's what the mob is demanding here. It is laughable. 

[visualstudios]

Just now, newsmike said:

But that is a fact in business.  Go look at airline reviews, iPhone reviews, any real product reviews...It's all there, the good, the bad and the ugly. This idea that Fiverr sellers should live in a bubble free of criticism with a mechanism to censor unhappy buyers with a quick payoff is ridiculous.  There are no legitimate businesses with 100% positive reviews because it's fraud and fantasy, yet that's what the mob is demanding here. It is laughable. 

Refer to my other comment on this. My problem here is the double whammy. You don't get paid for your work on a canceled order. And then you get a bad review on top. That's the issue.

On other businesses, the client can leave a bad review unfairly, of course. But on other businesses, the client pays.

[newsmike]

8 minutes ago, katakatica said:

I've had people curse, harass, stalk, etc. me. I'm worried that this might be the source of more issues in the long run. 

That, unfortunately is a different topic and should never be tolerated.

[newsmike]

1 minute ago, visualstudios said:

Refer to my other comment on this. My problem here is the double whammy. You don't get paid for your work on a canceled order. And then you get a bad review on top. That's the issue.

On other businesses, the client can leave a bad review unfairly, of course. But on other businesses, the client pays.

Are you suggesting that none has ever received a refund for a bad product or service and then left a bad review?  "I waited 3 hours for my meal, waiter was an idiot, they didn't charge me, but avoid. This place sucks" It happens every day, business is not perfect, unless you are a "perfect" Fiverr seller expecting a fantasy Island environment. 

[visualstudios]

3 minutes ago, newsmike said:

"I waited 3 hours for my meal,

We've already established that nobody has an issue with this applying to very late orders.

[newsmike]

Just now, visualstudios said:

We've already established that nobody has an issue with this applying to very late orders.

Or whatever the criticism. How about "Dead mouse in my spaghetti?"  You know what I'm saying.  You're still  making the case for suppressing information. period. 

[visualstudios]

2 minutes ago, newsmike said:

You're still  making the case for suppressing information

No. I want to suppress false information. If a buyer orders a voice over from you, gets it, then demands it be female, or that you read it in a different voice instead of your own, and gets a cancelation out of it, he shouldn't get to leave a 1 star review. Period. He ordered the wrong thing. 

I don't understand why you seem to think this only applies to meksells, and misleading sellers. Yes, there are a lot of bad sellers on the platform. But there are also a lot of bad buyers. Both should be eliminated. Yet you only focus on the bad sellers. 

Edited June 15, 2023 by visualstudios

[heyfellow1]

I've been bullied countlessly by my clients, this will perhaps make it more so. I do agree that something had to be done to improve accuracy but if all buyers have the right to do this ( still unclear if it's returning buyers only) , for me it's a recipe for disaster. I've cancelled countless order due to the fact the the buyer tried to bully me into either giving him more revisions, or creating another concept entirely or else they'd post a bad review. Now they're going to do this anyway ahaha. But I guess less buyers hurt profits but sellers are always replaceable( this is what in my opinion was fiverr's standpoint along the years)
 

• Hoping this is only available to returning customers as that would be suitable due to a line of communication being set before. 🤞

Edited June 15, 2023 by heyfellow1

[katakatica]

4 minutes ago, newsmike said:

That, unfortunately is a different topic and should never be tolerated.

It's a different topic but two of those people (with my current understand of the rules) would have been able to leave a negative review on my gigs just because. 

Sure, it's in special cases only, but it's always a possibility to consider. Since reviews aren't removed for no reason, it's worrisome. 

(I don't tolerate it, it's usually straight to blocking them but if there's on ongoing order...)

I do agree though that 4.7 was never a 100% reliable / honest score. People were afraid to leave worse reviews (many sellers at least). Bad reviews happen and they shouldn't be such a big deal.

I think what many are worried about is what those bad reveiws might mean for their business. Will a single bad review from someone do what a bad private review does and tank our impressions? Will it be regarded as normal and actually help in the long run?

[newsmike]

4 minutes ago, visualstudios said:

No. I want to suppress false information. If a buyer orders a voice over from you, gets it, then demands it be female, or that you read it in a different voice instead of your own, and gets a cancelation out of it, he shouldn't get to leave a 1 star review. Period. He ordered the wrong thing. 

I don't understand why you seem to think this only applies to meksells, and misleading sellers. Yes, there are a lot of bad sellers on the platform. But there are also a lot of bad buyers. Both should be eliminated. Yet you only focus on the bad sellers. 

That works fine as long as you get to be the 100% authority of what is "false."  It's good to be the king.

In your scenario, someone orders then says I wanted a female VO. The VO talent refuses to cancel as TOS says 100% supports.  Buyer leaves a bad review. VO talent responds and includes screenshot of moron buyer saying. "I wanted female, but ordered a male VO"

The world can see he's an idiot.  Why the shady games?

Truth is OK.  

[newsmike]

7 minutes ago, katakatica said:

It's a different topic but two of those people (with my current understand of the rules) would have been able to leave a negative review on my gigs just because. 

Sure, it's in special cases only, but it's always a possibility to consider. Since reviews aren't removed for no reason, it's worrisome. 

(I don't tolerate it, it's usually straight to blocking them but if there's on ongoing order...)

I do agree though that 4.7 was never a 100% reliable / honest score. People were afraid to leave worse reviews (many sellers at least). Bad reviews happen and they shouldn't be such a big deal.

I think what many are worried about is what those bad reveiws might mean for their business. Will a single bad review from someone do what a bad private review does and tank our impressions? Will it be regarded as normal and actually help in the long run?

Again, could you not post their abusive screenshot as a reply?  I do understand your point.

[leannelrivers]

I'm in the VO category, and bad experiences with my clients are rare, once in a blue moon, so I'm not worried about this (yay for me). I hope that Fiverr implements a more detailed set of review questions to get as much accurate information as possible about the reason for cancellation and whether a bad review is justified (if it is a bad review). 

My concern for the skilled sellers that could be unfairly affected by this change is that there isn't enough Fiverr manpower to investigate claims that the new review system has been used unscrupulously. Many of the changes to the platform result in sellers having to go through their offer with a fine-tooth comb to avoid anything that could lead to a misunderstanding - as in the case of first-time buyers. It's on us to make their entire process a breeze, including their overall satisfaction with the platform. Is it fair? Not when a lot of it is out of our hands. Do we need to get on with it and roll with the punches? If we want to sell on Fiverr, yeah. 

I am happy that this will prevent unskilled and scammy sellers from being able to cancel orders to avoid honest reviews about their shortcomings being shared publicly. And (if I understand correctly) buyers with seller accounts won't be able to use this to trash their competition. For every rip-off merchant snake of a buyer visiting this site, there is probably at least one slithering seller to go with them. 

I hope this does not unfairly affect talented, professional, honest freelancers and that CS supports them with cases that require a closer look. As for the cheats, good luck. 

[visualstudios]

37 minutes ago, katakatica said:

Bad reviews happen and they shouldn't be such a big deal.

Of course, but they are a big deal because Fiverr made them a big deal, by setting the threshold at 4.7. It was their choice to do that. Of course that heavily incentivises sellers to do anything within their power to avoid any review other than 5 stars. If you had your reviews be public, but that didn't affect your level, etc. then this wouldn't be as much of an issue.

The reviews would actually better serve their purpose - let buyers know what they're buying. Like, if you're a level 2 and have a 4.0 average review, buyers will already largely prefer to buy from the level 2 seller next to you with a 4.9 average. Why do they need to take the level away from you on top of that? If they didn't do that, there would be much less manipulation.

Edited June 15, 2023 by visualstudios

[roberthazelton]

On 6/14/2023 at 7:03 AM, newsmike said:

This should add some clarity as buyers can indicate whether they simply ordered by mistake or did not need the service, which should not come with a penalty, or if the cancellation was due to poor service, quality or lack of professionalism. The latter would qualify for a punitive strike against the seller.

There is no reason to ask the seller, because as we see here in the forum, every single cancellation, from the seller's point of view is unjust and "for no reason." Why waste time processing the inevitable junk data?  

My understanding is they have to receive a delivery for a review. So if they order by mistake, the information stated they cannot actually leave a review.

[mb100]

1 hour ago, newsmike said:

Perhaps if you searched and educated yourself on years of forum history you would know, fella. Have you considered educating yourself PRIOR to posting? 

How ignorant!

[newsmike]

1 minute ago, mb100 said:

How ignorant!

Yes you are, but I was being polite by not pointing it out directly. That would have answered your "who is WE" question.  Read and learn.  Then post.

Edited June 15, 2023 by newsmike

[roberthazelton]

There's no transparency gained by reviewing cancelled orders. No benefit to the community for someone to throw out a negative review about a cancelled order. No trust built. 

If a seller ignores your policies (limited revisions for example), then a seller is now beholden to them to finish regardless.

Fiverr may call it all the things I mentioned in the first paragraph, but ultimately they are pressuring sellers to finish orders regardless of whether they are abused by the buyer. They want their 20% and a cancelled order takes that away. So everyone might as well put down that they do unlimited revisions including closed orders (at least up to 2 weeks after) because if you don't, you'll get a negative review regardless.

[mb100]

Just now, newsmike said:

Yes you are, but I was being polite by not pointing it out directly. 

Try and be impolite next time.

[strategist_ceo]

2 minutes ago, mb100 said:

How ignorant!

 

 

Is it truly ignorant to search the forum's history for the same topic or information before posting? It seems like a sensible approach to gather existing information and avoid redundancy.

[italianspeaker]

I'm in the VO category as well. I want just share a couple of considerations.

I think that we should always think different when we talk about selling services. It is different form selling things: if you buy a pen and that doesn't write, you can go to the shop and demonstrate the pen is not writing, and 99% times you'll get a new one working.

If you buy a service it is not so easy to define what's good and what's bad. Sometimes can be matter of taste. But of course you can leave a review, or get a second delivery. I use to offer a second delivery re-recording the script if the client is unhappy.

And, what about the reviwes like "oh fantastic pro, hreat job, more than expected! 2 stars"? lol. It happens everywhere on the net, but nobody has a way to prevent or control that kind of reviews. 

 

[chrisaxworthy]

On 6/14/2023 at 4:48 PM, donnovan86 said:

However it doesn't say first time buyers to Fiverr or YOUR first time buyers. But I assume it's people buying from you, the freelancer, for the first time. If it's the latter, I am fine with it because the chances of a return client canceling are very low. It can still happen though. 

 

On 6/14/2023 at 4:50 PM, donnovan86 said:

As I said above in my post,  Buyers (excluding first-time buyers) can leave a review for canceled orders. So first time buyers can't leave a review on canceled orders.

Actually, first time buyers that buy from you can leave a review after cancellation as long as they've used the platform to purchase at least once. I've asked them.

[donnovan86]

8 minutes ago, chrisaxworthy said:

I've asked them.

Yesm they confirmed to me yesterday, after those posts.