An old order has been canceled, and now my balance is negative

[adsensewizard]

I have seen many people mention that Fiverr compensates you partially if you get robbed like that. But not sure if there’s any special requirements for that.

[chrisdata]

Fiverr should take 100% responsible for a PP chargeback.
We as seller work our ass off to deliver awesome work, we shouldn’t get penalty due to the transaction between fiverr & PP, we not the one who ask fiverr to take PP as their main payment system, it’s fiverr chosen PP as their payment system, how come we get penalty if the payment system fault?

fiverr you should invent your own payment system for freelancing industry and do not let PP holding u back and causing all your precious seller worry this problem. You can do it.

[catalin00]

It looks like they are not going to do anything. This is the (template) message I received after waiting 24 hours. They didn’t even say they would look into the situation, as they promised to other sellers.

[cubittaudio]

It looks like they are not going to do anything. This is the (template) message I received after waiting 24 hours. They didn’t even say they would look into the situation, as they promised to other sellers.

2018-11-15_113540.png700×593 43.7 KB

It looks like they are not going to do anything. This is the (template) message I received after waiting 24 hours. They didn’t even say they would look into the situation, as they promised to other sellers.

I’m sorry to see that this isn’t looking promising for you.

It’s a worrying thought that this can happen so easily. We’ve completed a number of large orders before that, were they to be charged back, would massively impact our monthly earnings. On a quieter month, they could put us into a negative value. I’d like to say we’re strong enough that we could dust it off and work for free to clear a $500 ‘debt’ to Fiverr, but I don’t know if we would. It could be the nail in the coffin that would push us to work elsewhere.

Hopefully you can bounce back from this. Good luck to you.

I totally agree with you that this is grossly unfair. If someone steals a credit card and orders work on Fiverr, you have;

• The defrauded person
• The fraudster
• PayPal
• Fiverr
• The seller

So why is it ultimately the seller who is punished? Why is it that neither PayPal, nor Fiverr are willing to say “we make a lot of money from our sellers, so we will offer you some level of protection or insurance”? I get that Fiverr can’t simply offer unlimited protection, because fraud would dramatically increase.

As a seller, I’d even consider a monthly ‘insurance’ policy, where an additional % of our earnings could buy us a ‘Seller Protection Policy’. The peace of mind would be worth a small monthly cost.

[maanza_55]

Oh wow 😕 My experiences with CS till now have been decently personal, but the above message has no ounce of empathy in it. Or even sympathy, for that matter. Why do we even have CS in the form of people if the messages they do end up sending in these cases are this robotic? It’s so frustrating for every seller facing this situation, or any other major issue that requires CS intervention.

I get that CS can’t do anything if it’s not possible (for whatever reason they state), but the least they can do, is properly explain (in their ticket message back) why they can’t do it in such-and-such case (because I believe that Fiverr has been able to get back the chargeback money for sellers in the past and across certain cases). Naturally, every seller facing a chargeback, on reading forum posts of successfully contested chargebacks, would ideally like that scenario to occur. And if that doesn’t happen (for whatever reason), they would naturally want an explanation as to why it didn’t work out in their case. Fiverr really needs to give a legitimate, thorough response based on each, individual case. Not this templated stuff.

(I’m not saying that a non-robotic, sympathetic CS reply can solve the entire problem, but it does go some way in helping the seller know that CS is actively trying to figure out a way, is in the seller’s corner, and that they genuinely feel bad about the seller’s situation if they can’t find a solution. The above CS message sounds rote and like they honestly don’t care, tbh.)

And if Fiverr is aware that they don’t get paid either in these kind of scenarios, I don’t understand why they haven’t done anything about it already. Multiple sellers have been asking for this to happen, not just one. And I don’t know if it’s just me, but I feel that the amount of PayPal chargebacks are just increasing by the day. It just doesn’t make sense.

Hang in there, @catalin00. So sorry you had to go through this.

PS: Also, on another note, did CS mark your ticket as resolved or is it still open?

[catalin00]

Oh wow 😕 My experiences with CS till now have been decently personal, but the above message has no ounce of empathy in it. Or even sympathy, for that matter. Why do we even have CS in the form of people if the messages they do end up sending in these cases are this robotic? It’s so frustrating for every seller facing this situation, or any other major issue that requires CS intervention.

I get that CS can’t do anything if it’s not possible (for whatever reason they state), but the least they can do, is properly explain (in their ticket message back) why they can’t do it in such-and-such case (because I believe that Fiverr has been able to get back the chargeback money for sellers in the past and across certain cases). Naturally, every seller facing a chargeback, on reading forum posts of successfully contested chargebacks, would ideally like that scenario to occur. And if that doesn’t happen (for whatever reason), they would naturally want an explanation as to why it didn’t work out in their case. Fiverr really needs to give a legitimate, thorough response based on each, individual case. Not this templated stuff.

(I’m not saying that a non-robotic, sympathetic CS reply can solve the entire problem, but it does go some way in helping the seller know that CS is actively trying to figure out a way, is in the seller’s corner, and that they genuinely feel bad about the seller’s situation if they can’t find a solution. The above CS message sounds rote and like they honestly don’t care, tbh.)

And if Fiverr is aware that they don’t get paid either in these kind of scenarios, I don’t understand why they haven’t done anything about it already. Multiple sellers have been asking for this to happen, not just one. And I don’t know if it’s just me, but I feel that the amount of PayPal chargebacks are just increasing by the day. It just doesn’t make sense.

Hang in there, @catalin00. So sorry you had to go through this.

PS: Also, on another note, did CS mark your ticket as resolved or is it still open?

Hi, thank you for the comment. They left the ticket Open, so I wrote back with more questions. I think the reason why they don’t do anything is that they don’t really care. The money that they lose is passive income, as I said above. They don’t like losing it, but it’s not that big of a deal for them, as they simply wait for other orders to get back their cut from commissions. It’s me who actually worked for the money, and now the client has a free software, and I have to work for free the next month to cover up for it. And nobody will do anything about it. Fiverr really doesn’t apply any punishment to these people, although what they are doing is illegal. Deleting the account is not really a punishment, nor does it stop the buyer from creating a new account and doing this again.

At least if the payments would be made directly through PayPal, I would be able to fight a chargeback, and PayPal staff look like they would be willing to help in such situations. It’s sad to say it but working through Fiverr only complicates things. They should look at their competition, like Upwork for example, who has programs and people in place to prevent such fraud, and they even have seller protection, that ensures a freelancer’s revenue is safe.

[catalin00]

And by the way, replying once every 24 hours is not really what a person who just lost $600 would consider help, or “support”. The CS is basically a joke.

[cubittaudio]

Hi, thank you for the comment. They left the ticket Open, so I wrote back with more questions. I think the reason why they don’t do anything is that they don’t really care. The money that they lose is passive income, as I said above. They don’t like losing it, but it’s not that big of a deal for them, as they simply wait for other orders to get back their cut from commissions. It’s me who actually worked for the money, and now the client has a free software, and I have to work for free the next month to cover up for it. And nobody will do anything about it. Fiverr really doesn’t apply any punishment to these people, although what they are doing is illegal. Deleting the account is not really a punishment, nor does it stop the buyer from creating a new account and doing this again.

At least if the payments would be made directly through PayPal, I would be able to fight a chargeback, and PayPal staff look like they would be willing to help in such situations. It’s sad to say it but working through Fiverr only complicates things. They should look at their competition, like Upwork for example, who has programs and people in place to prevent such fraud, and they even have seller protection, that ensures a freelancer’s revenue is safe.

who has programs and people in place to prevent such fraud, and they even have seller protection, that ensures a freelancer’s revenue is safe.

Perhaps this will get better. Many people have noted recently that Fiverr appear to be pushing away from being ‘the place where you get stuff done for 5 bucks’ to being a truly professional marketplace that can compete with the kind of sites you’ve mentioned. In doing so, average order values are going to increase, and chargebacks are going to begin to really hurt.

Let’s be honest - if this was $5 instead of $500, you might have opened a thread to have a well-deserved rant, but that would be the end of it. $500 is considerable.

I do think some kind of ‘Seller Protection Policy’ has to be incoming, whatever form that may take. What happens when the first Pro Seller gets a chargeback on their $5,000 logo?

[catalin00]

who has programs and people in place to prevent such fraud, and they even have seller protection, that ensures a freelancer’s revenue is safe.

Perhaps this will get better. Many people have noted recently that Fiverr appear to be pushing away from being ‘the place where you get stuff done for 5 bucks’ to being a truly professional marketplace that can compete with the kind of sites you’ve mentioned. In doing so, average order values are going to increase, and chargebacks are going to begin to really hurt.

Let’s be honest - if this was $5 instead of $500, you might have opened a thread to have a well-deserved rant, but that would be the end of it. $500 is considerable.

I do think some kind of ‘Seller Protection Policy’ has to be incoming, whatever form that may take. What happens when the first Pro Seller gets a chargeback on their $5,000 logo?

if this was $5 instead of $500, you might have opened a thread to have a well-deserved rant,

If it was $5, I wouldn’t have bothered to open a thread, just to waste time. For the place I live in, $500 is the salary for a month. Fiverr is my only source of income, and now they are asking me to pay them, out of the blue. I still don’t know how I will manage to pay back the order.

What happens when the first Pro Seller gets a chargeback on their $5,000 logo?

I don’t want to underestimate anyone’s work, but maybe $5k for a logo is a bit much. Anyway, it would be indeed a big loss for a pro seller. However, my intuition tells me that fiverr treats the pro sellers more carefully. For example, I cannot picture them allowing someone to scam Rob Janoff, if you know what I mean.

[maanza_55]

if this was $5 instead of $500, you might have opened a thread to have a well-deserved rant,

If it was $5, I wouldn’t have bothered to open a thread, just to waste time. For the place I live in, $500 is the salary for a month. Fiverr is my only source of income, and now they are asking me to pay them, out of the blue. I still don’t know how I will manage to pay back the order.

What happens when the first Pro Seller gets a chargeback on their $5,000 logo?

I don’t want to underestimate anyone’s work, but maybe $5k for a logo is a bit much. Anyway, it would be indeed a big loss for a pro seller. However, my intuition tells me that fiverr treats the pro sellers more carefully. For example, I cannot picture them allowing someone to scam Rob Janoff, if you know what I mean.

Your intuition is most probably right. They may even have different policies in place for the Pro section. Because if there’s any kind of chargeback on any Pro, it’s most definitely going to generate a lot of negative PR.

And even if they (Fiverr) try to quell it, I’m sure the news will definitely, still get out.

[catalin00]

Your intuition is most probably right. They may even have different policies in place for the Pro section. Because if there’s any kind of chargeback on any Pro, it’s most definitely going to generate a lot of negative PR.

And even if they (Fiverr) try to quell it, I’m sure the news will definitely, still get out.

Ok, so we are discriminated because we cannot generate enough negative advertising. What a place to do business…

Anyway, I can understand somehow that they have more important things to do than fighting for my $500. However, what really ticks me off is the fact that they are asking me to pay for an order I had 3 months ago. I don’t know what I should do next. What if this happens again, after I put some money in my balance? What if another 3 clients do the same? In 3 years I’ve had a lot of big orders. Just a few of them could steal all my income for the next few months.

If someone decides to request a chargeback while I have funds pending clearance or withdrawal, there would be no way for me to get the money back. However, now I am on negative balance, meaning they can’t yet take anything from me.

Right now I have the opportunity to close my account and refuse to pay anything. I can convince the current clients to pay me directly and use email for communication and forget about Fiverr. I am really considering this, but I don’t know if it would be the right decision to make. What do you think? Does anyone have any opinions on what would be better? Staying or leaving?

[catalin00]

Well, as a follow-up: I received a new message asking me to send them some proof that I completed the order, for better assistance. I put together a well-documented letter explaining that the client approved the delivery, along with screenshots of the software and conversation I had with the client, and I even included the actual installer of the program.

The fact that they asked for proof looks promising. I really hope this will get sorted out.

[maanza_55]

Well, as a follow-up: I received a new message asking me to send them some proof that I completed the order, for better assistance. I put together a well-documented letter explaining that the client approved the delivery, along with screenshots of the software and conversation I had with the client, and I even included the actual installer of the program.

The fact that they asked for proof looks promising. I really hope this will get sorted out.

That’s great to hear! Let’s hope they’re investigating your chargeback case actively and that you can rightfully get your money back.

Well, with regard to your above-posed question, I guess it comes down to how invaluable Fiverr is to your monthly earnings and how big of a chunk it takes up - is it your primary source of income? Or do you earn better when you do other kinds of freelance projects?

Secondly (and unfortunately), unless Fiverr fixes this chargeback issue with PayPal, sellers all over the site are still liable to be penalised and have their money taken away from them, in case of unsuccessful chargeback contestations. I wish I could tell you that it wouldn’t happen again, but given the alarming rate at which chargebacks are increasing by the day, there is a possibility that it could happen another time. I guess it’s a calculated risk that sellers will have to take if they want to continue selling on a site with no proper infrastructure/action against these kinds of cases.

Or a ‘Seller Protection Policy’, like @cubittaudio had mentioned.

If you think that you will generate more income working on any other platforms or maybe even working on projects on the ground, and if you feel that your exit from Fiverr won’t be detrimental to your current level of earning & that you can make the money you were making on Fiverr (or more) elsewhere, then there wouldn’t be any problem in you moving on from here and forgetting about Fiverr.

As for me, I would recommend seeing how your chargeback situation pans out and then, maybe taking a decision. Leaving the site or closing your account won’t be the best move right now if they are actively trying to get your money back to you. In the case that Fiverr isn’t successful in getting the money back for you, then you can weigh the pros and cons of both outcomes (on Fiverr or off) and take an ultimate decision of what will benefit you in the long run.

Also, (I have no clue about this), but please check in the ToS if a seller is allowed to leave the site/close their account if they have a negative balance. Something tells me that Fiverr won’t let you close your account that easily if they see a negative balance reflected because then, they would’ve lost their money twice over in that case. (They would’ve already lost it once as PayPal would’ve taken it from them. That’s why they take their lost money from the seller’s earnings, I suppose.)

This is just my perspective on your situation. I’m sure other forum members will have their own takes on your question as well. Their replies will help you gain clarity on how to proceed. 🙂

But I really hope things work out for you @catalin00! Praying that you get your money back. Please keep us updated!

[bestitsolution7]

Thanks for sharing the information.

[catalin00]

That’s great to hear! Let’s hope they’re investigating your chargeback case actively and that you can rightfully get your money back.

Well, with regard to your above-posed question, I guess it comes down to how invaluable Fiverr is to your monthly earnings and how big of a chunk it takes up - is it your primary source of income? Or do you earn better when you do other kinds of freelance projects?

Secondly (and unfortunately), unless Fiverr fixes this chargeback issue with PayPal, sellers all over the site are still liable to be penalised and have their money taken away from them, in case of unsuccessful chargeback contestations. I wish I could tell you that it wouldn’t happen again, but given the alarming rate at which chargebacks are increasing by the day, there is a possibility that it could happen another time. I guess it’s a calculated risk that sellers will have to take if they want to continue selling on a site with no proper infrastructure/action against these kinds of cases.

Or a ‘Seller Protection Policy’, like @cubittaudio had mentioned.

If you think that you will generate more income working on any other platforms or maybe even working on projects on the ground, and if you feel that your exit from Fiverr won’t be detrimental to your current level of earning & that you can make the money you were making on Fiverr (or more) elsewhere, then there wouldn’t be any problem in you moving on from here and forgetting about Fiverr.

As for me, I would recommend seeing how your chargeback situation pans out and then, maybe taking a decision. Leaving the site or closing your account won’t be the best move right now if they are actively trying to get your money back to you. In the case that Fiverr isn’t successful in getting the money back for you, then you can weigh the pros and cons of both outcomes (on Fiverr or off) and take an ultimate decision of what will benefit you in the long run.

Also, (I have no clue about this), but please check in the ToS if a seller is allowed to leave the site/close their account if they have a negative balance. Something tells me that Fiverr won’t let you close your account that easily if they see a negative balance reflected because then, they would’ve lost their money twice over in that case. (They would’ve already lost it once as PayPal would’ve taken it from them. That’s why they take their lost money from the seller’s earnings, I suppose.)

This is just my perspective on your situation. I’m sure other forum members will have their own takes on your question as well. Their replies will help you gain clarity on how to proceed. 🙂

But I really hope things work out for you @catalin00! Praying that you get your money back. Please keep us updated!

Something tells me that Fiverr won’t let you close your account that easily if they see a negative balance reflected

Well, they can’t do much, can they? I can’t imagine them coming after me instead of trying to recover the money from the buyer. If they can’t force the buyer to pay for his order, they surely won’t force me.

then, they would’ve lost their money twice over

I don’t think this is how it works. They are not losing twice the value. The buyer paid it, they had it, and now they don’t have it anymore. This is why they are trying to get the money from me. If they manage to do that, they don’t lose anything. If for some reason I don’t give them back this amount, they will just miss it, but the value doesn’t double.

[maanza_55]

That’s great to hear! Let’s hope they’re investigating your chargeback case actively and that you can rightfully get your money back.

Well, with regard to your above-posed question, I guess it comes down to how invaluable Fiverr is to your monthly earnings and how big of a chunk it takes up - is it your primary source of income? Or do you earn better when you do other kinds of freelance projects?

Secondly (and unfortunately), unless Fiverr fixes this chargeback issue with PayPal, sellers all over the site are still liable to be penalised and have their money taken away from them, in case of unsuccessful chargeback contestations. I wish I could tell you that it wouldn’t happen again, but given the alarming rate at which chargebacks are increasing by the day, there is a possibility that it could happen another time. I guess it’s a calculated risk that sellers will have to take if they want to continue selling on a site with no proper infrastructure/action against these kinds of cases.

Or a ‘Seller Protection Policy’, like @cubittaudio had mentioned.

If you think that you will generate more income working on any other platforms or maybe even working on projects on the ground, and if you feel that your exit from Fiverr won’t be detrimental to your current level of earning & that you can make the money you were making on Fiverr (or more) elsewhere, then there wouldn’t be any problem in you moving on from here and forgetting about Fiverr.

As for me, I would recommend seeing how your chargeback situation pans out and then, maybe taking a decision. Leaving the site or closing your account won’t be the best move right now if they are actively trying to get your money back to you. In the case that Fiverr isn’t successful in getting the money back for you, then you can weigh the pros and cons of both outcomes (on Fiverr or off) and take an ultimate decision of what will benefit you in the long run.

Also, (I have no clue about this), but please check in the ToS if a seller is allowed to leave the site/close their account if they have a negative balance. Something tells me that Fiverr won’t let you close your account that easily if they see a negative balance reflected because then, they would’ve lost their money twice over in that case. (They would’ve already lost it once as PayPal would’ve taken it from them. That’s why they take their lost money from the seller’s earnings, I suppose.)

This is just my perspective on your situation. I’m sure other forum members will have their own takes on your question as well. Their replies will help you gain clarity on how to proceed. 🙂

But I really hope things work out for you @catalin00! Praying that you get your money back. Please keep us updated!

(They would’ve already lost it once as PayPal would’ve taken it from them. That’s why they take their lost money from the seller’s earnings, I suppose.)

Yes @catalin00. The above is what I meant by twice-over when I wrote this above. I didn’t mean twice the value. Sorry if that wasn’t clear. I meant that they probably won’t let you leave the site/close your account until they get the money from you, because they can’t get it from either PayPal or the buyer.

But like I mentioned earlier, not sure about this aspect though. Maybe ToS will have more clarity on this aspect. Or any other seller who’s experienced a similar situation.

[Guest digitalvalve]

Fiverr should take 100% responsible for a PP chargeback.

We as seller work our ass off to deliver awesome work, we shouldn’t get penalty due to the transaction between fiverr & PP, we not the one who ask fiverr to take PP as their main payment system, it’s fiverr chosen PP as their payment system, how come we get penalty if the payment system fault?

fiverr you should invent your own payment system for freelancing industry and do not let PP holding u back and causing all your precious seller worry this problem. You can do it.

Fiverr should take 100% responsible for a PP chargeback.

We as seller work our ass off to deliver awesome work, we shouldn’t get penalty due to the transaction between fiverr & PP, we not the one who ask fiverr to take PP as their main payment system, it’s fiverr chosen PP as their payment system, how come we get penalty if the payment system fault?

fiverr you should invent your own payment system for freelancing industry and do not let PP holding u back and causing all your precious seller worry this problem. You can do it.

Yes… wish that they can do it 💪

[catalin00]

Hi everyone, new update, and good news! It seems that they’ve decided to give me a refund! 😃 I am not sure if they managed to contact the buyer and get the money from him, or if they just considered that I deserved the money and paid the refund themselves. Anyway, I am glad that the problem is finally over.

My statistics (completion rate) is still low because of this, and I got demoted from my level. It sucks, but at least I got the money back, and I am happy with this achievement.

[salmanmaqsood80]

they don’t resolve this to your favor.

This is only relevant to your case.

i am also a victim of charge back and didn’t get anything from fiverr not even a single penny yeah!!! but some lame excuses and that’s it

[orcatek]

Sad. I keep seeing Paypal commercials now saying they “PROTECT THE SELLER”. Well that is total crap as we all know.

Had the same thing happen to me. I knew the customer company as it was in the product and found them using the video on facebook and youtube. A few minutes spent sending a DMCA takedown notice and the videos were gone. I always keep tabs on clients who try to steal and hunt them down.

Don’t know what service you provided, but you may be able to track them down. If it was writing, you can text search on google. Artwork, google image search.

[alifstyle]

Yes, Paypal can refund money to buyer but It’s not easy. We need write an official report and real people from Paypal will decide if that’s fake report or not. Paypal will get certain amount for that refund.

[zachsleeper]

Yeah, I understand. Thank you once again for the reply. Having an idea of what the issue was helped me relax a bit. I hope the Customer Support guys will reply soon.

Good luck I hope this all worked out!

I love how everyone showed out in support for you.

[catalin00]

Sad. I keep seeing Paypal commercials now saying they “PROTECT THE SELLER”. Well that is total crap as we all know.

Had the same thing happen to me. I knew the customer company as it was in the product and found them using the video on facebook and youtube. A few minutes spent sending a DMCA takedown notice and the videos were gone. I always keep tabs on clients who try to steal and hunt them down.

Don’t know what service you provided, but you may be able to track them down. If it was writing, you can text search on google. Artwork, google image search.

you may be able to track them down

Not really. The product was a software program for internal use, so there is no way they will make it public. However, it doesn’t matter, as long as I got the money.

[catalin00]

Good luck I hope this all worked out!

I love how everyone showed out in support for you.

I love how everyone showed out in support for you

Yes, it’s indeed encouraging that people on the forums actually care.

[bestitsolution7]

I also don’t know about it…