Negative Impact on ''Effective Communication''

[ch6k0r]

Hello!

I've read the "Success Score Explained" article and understand what it means.

However, I still don't understand why it seems that I should be communicating in a way that doesn't match how my field works.

I'm a jingle/intro music producer, so for example, a client messages me with their project needs, doing a fantastic job of simplifying everything or giving me enough creative freedom that it doesn't require much give and take in our conversation.

Most of my orders come in this way, or the client submits their requirements in the same way, with me asking an extra question or two on the order page before starting.

My projects are small, straightforward, and have quick deliveries. How am I supposed to communicate "more effectively"?

Regarding politeness and professionalism, I see myself doing well. I have improved a lot over the years by making the conversation more casual and friendly.

So, long story short, my orders don't require much communication (especially if we've already talked in the inbox), and I already follow the "Effective Communication" tips.

Has anyone improved their score in this area? What did you change in your communication to improve?

Edited July 23 by ch6k0r
Grammar

[navid_zafar]

1 hour ago, ch6k0r said:

Hello!

I've read the "Success Score Explained" article and understand what it means.

However, I still don't understand why it seems that I should be communicating in a way that doesn't match how my field works.

I'm a jingle/intro music producer, so for example, a client messages me with their project needs, doing a fantastic job of simplifying everything or giving me enough creative freedom that it doesn't require much give and take in our conversation.

Most of my orders come in this way, or the client submits their requirements in the same way, with me asking an extra question or two on the order page before starting.

My projects are small, straightforward, and have quick deliveries. How am I supposed to communicate "more effectively"?

Regarding politeness and professionalism, I see myself doing well. I have improved a lot over the years by making the conversation more casual and friendly.

So, long story short, my orders don't require much communication (especially if we've already talked in the inbox), and I already follow the "Effective Communication" tips.

Has anyone improved their score in this area? What did you change in your communication to improve?

Here is a related topic, might be worth reading:

 

[vovkaslovesnyy]

1 hour ago, ch6k0r said:

Has anyone improved their score in this area? What did you change in your communication to improve?

Yes, I did. 

My orders were pretty much the same, but, as I've mentioned before, everything is AI-based now. 

AI doesn't really care if you don't need to communicate on the order page. 

1. When your buyer first contacts you, you need to greet them, thank them for the request, and make an offer. 

2. If they don't purchase your services, it will hit your score for the first time. 

3. If they do purchase something, write a long and polite message on the order page to thank them for the order. Add estimated delivery time, including services, and other stuff. Even if it was a custom offer, do this. 

4. If possible, send updates on the order page. 

5. When delivering the order, write a long message, and politely ask for an honest review. 

6. If there's nothing after your delivery, politely remind them that you liked working with them, and ask for their feedback once more. 

Now, regarding Step 6, I rarely do this because Fiverr reminds buyers to leave a review many times, and when I do this once again, I usually get average private reviews, e.g., "You want me to be honest?! There you go!" 😁

One more thing, these days, if your buyer doesn't leave any review but closes your order (Completed but no review), your score will also tank a bit 😅

Why? Obviously because of your poor communication skills 😁

[voicingthings]

I'd heard that last point too about scores taking a hit if the buyer is just totally unresponsive! Couldn't believe it. Fair enough if perhaps the seller just didn't bother chasing, but even if the seller chases the score can take a hit...Mental! What if the buyer forgets? What if they have a family tragedy or something? It's honestly mind boggling.

Where did you hear about point number 2? That is also crazy to think that could be a thing. Thanks so much for bringing this to my attention as it's something I hadn't even considered. Fiverr asks you to be open and honest and set expectations. Surely this encourages people to try to force a sale at all costs. 

From my experience speaking to people in Fiverr...nobody knows what's going one which is pretty scary. We're all just trying to please these unknown "Fiverr Gods"... 

[litcornerbooks]

I have two gigs that show communication stats. I talk to my clients the same way. No change of approach, nothing different in the style of communication. One gig shows a negative impact of communication. The second gig shows a very positive communication effect... 😄 I really don't understand. And I really refuse to write long messages and keep thanking the buyers over and over for an order. We are no dogs or slaves here. We offer valuable work, we are often experts in our fields here. Proper and polite communication should be a standard. But not repeating the details of the order and thanking and doing it again and again. 

[vovkaslovesnyy]

1 hour ago, voicingthings said:

Where did you hear about point number 2?

By looking at 2 of my gigs, which have no orders but do have incoming messages with no conversion. 

For both of them, it turned from "Room for growth" to "Negative Impact."

There were no new orders, so nothing else could affect it. 

At the same time, I have a proofreading gig, where I managed to change this indicator from red to green by using things, which I described above. 

6 orders were enough to change it. 

Edited July 24 by vovkaslovesnyy

[simonjonesmusic]

I'm turning away prospective buyers because they present a risk to 'client satisfaction' at the back end of the order. Usually badly recorded/poor audio which they will never be happy with.

Great.

[voicingthings]

54 minutes ago, vovkaslovesnyy said:

By looking at 2 of my gigs, which have no orders but do have incoming messages with no conversion. 

For both of them, it turned from "Room for growth" to "Negative Impact."

There were no new orders, so nothing else could affect it. 

At the same time, I have a proofreading gig, where I managed to change this indicator from red to green by using things, which I described above. 

6 orders were enough to change it. 

That's really interesting! I hadn't thought of that. I've had gigs change score with no orders before. That makes sense. Thanks so much for explaining.

Wonder if they'll eventually train that out of the AI because it just seems incredibly unfair and almost counter productive. Especially if sellers don't even know about it haha! 

[voicingthings]

1 hour ago, litcornerbooks said:

I have two gigs that show communication stats. I talk to my clients the same way. No change of approach, nothing different in the style of communication. One gig shows a negative impact of communication. The second gig shows a very positive communication effect... 😄 I really don't understand. And I really refuse to write long messages and keep thanking the buyers over and over for an order. We are no dogs or slaves here. We offer valuable work, we are often experts in our fields here. Proper and polite communication should be a standard. But not repeating the details of the order and thanking and doing it again and again. 

Couldn't agree more! 

What I keep getting thrown at me is, "it's comparative with others in your category" but I still don't think it makes sense how two of your gig scores can be so vastly different! I've experiencing exactly the same situation as you. 

[simonjonesmusic]

Guys the reason the scores are so different between other sellers in the same category is down to the difference in the volume of orders over the same time period.

Fiverr calculates all of these things as percentages, so if your orders/messages/whatever is low, one single bad hit can be devastating.

If your orders/messages are high, one bad hit is negligible.

I've been banging on about this for ages, I've sent detailed emails to my (ex) success manager and to support. Nobody gets it, nobody sees the problem.

All these stats are calculated in percentages, they are useless, worthless, bad data and they are killing seller accounts.

[mandyzines]

34 minutes ago, simonjonesmusic said:

Guys the reason the scores are so different between other sellers in the same category is down to the difference in the volume of orders over the same time period.

I have to wonder if it's broken down further for Voice Artists; I would hope that it is. A fairy-voiced GenZ woman can't be compared to a deep, textured GenX man by voice print alone, for instance. 

  

43 minutes ago, voicingthings said:

Couldn't agree more! 

What I keep getting thrown at me is, "it's comparative with others in your category" but I still don't think it makes sense how two of your gig scores can be so vastly different! I've experiencing exactly the same situation as you. 

I can see that answer being given when someone doesn't really know the answer.

Edited July 24 by mandyzines

[priyank_mod]

2 hours ago, litcornerbooks said:

I talk to my clients the same way. No change of approach, nothing different in the style of communication. One gig shows a negative impact of communication. The second gig shows a very positive communication effect...

Yes, we all converse in the same manner with our buyers across all the gigs. 

But, the nature of orders and conversations can vary. For example, one gig may have had only a couple of polite disagreements or buyer disliking the work in last 2 years (positive impact) while other gig might have had 5+ instances of disagreements, disputes or even just a couple of cancellations (negative impact). 

Also in your case, the order base is very small (16 reviews) - so even just one less-than-ideal kinda order can have disproportionately high negative impact. 

[simonjonesmusic]

4 hours ago, voicingthings said:

Couldn't agree more! 

What I keep getting thrown at me is, "it's comparative with others in your category" but I still don't think it makes sense how two of your gig scores can be so vastly different! I've experiencing exactly the same situation as you. 

I've read this and in my opinion it's complete nonsense. The calculation it's doing isn't as sophisticated as that. It's using basic percentages. The ranking may be comparative with other sellers but the scoring you see most certainly is not.

Right now I am trying to find out why one of my gigs has suddenly and inexplicably dropped it's customer satisfaction score. Haven't had an order on it in weeks, and the most recent client left no private feedback according to support.

Right now it looks to me like not only is it poorly designed but bugged to all hell.

[mateusbl]

On 7/23/2024 at 2:26 PM, vovkaslovesnyy said:

If they don't purchase your services, it will hit your score for the first time. 

Many buyers contact you without see the price on the gigs.... at the end you will send an offer based on your Gig Packages and buyers will not purchase if they think is expensive. If you send the offer of $100 and the buyer say his budget is $5 so you need do it for $5 to not be affected.

On 7/23/2024 at 2:26 PM, vovkaslovesnyy said:

If there's nothing after your delivery, politely remind them that you liked working with them, and ask for their feedback once more.

Fiverr send a lot of emails and notifications, is really annoying that Sellers also keep sending messages for buyers make something. I already did it this week, order auto completed, the buyer did not replied me back even after I messaged them to say if they need something they cold contact me.

On 7/23/2024 at 2:26 PM, vovkaslovesnyy said:

if your buyer doesn't leave any review but closes your order (Completed but no review), your score will also tank a bit

I guess Fiverr forgot we are Freelancers who work alone, I know some sellers who work in almost 100 orders monthly. I just wanna know how they will be able to answers new clients, current clients, message them many times asking feedback, keep them posted about progress, work on projects, revisions.

Fiverr expect to much of Freelancers, we are not a team or an agency, #wearehumans #soloworkers

[voicingthings]

21 hours ago, simonjonesmusic said:

I've read this and in my opinion it's complete nonsense. The calculation it's doing isn't as sophisticated as that. It's using basic percentages. The ranking may be comparative with other sellers but the scoring you see most certainly is not.

Right now I am trying to find out why one of my gigs has suddenly and inexplicably dropped it's customer satisfaction score. Haven't had an order on it in weeks, and the most recent client left no private feedback according to support.

Right now it looks to me like not only is it poorly designed but bugged to all hell.

Yeah some of the reasons I've been getting told for the scores just don't make any sense at all. They must be getting thousands of complaints about this new system. It's just mind boggling. 

[voicingthings]

On 7/24/2024 at 7:18 PM, mandyzines said:

I can see that answer being given when someone doesn't really know the answer.

Totally agree!

[simonjonesmusic]

After some back and forth with support, it's clear to me that the best course of action is to continue as normal, and wait for the negative hit to drop out of the (presumably 3 month) time window that the new system uses.

Ignore the metrics, they will be moving up and down as data drops off and new data comes in.

The same applies to negative private feedback.

When your score goes back up, you'll be able to figure out which order was holding it down - it'll be the order or one of the orders 3 months prior.

It's a really basic system, laughably described to me by Fiverr support as 'complex data science'. It is of no value to sellers and provides no data you can work with.

 

Used smartly however, it can provide insight into which order caused the negative hit, data that Fiverr wants to keep hidden.

[collinsconsult]

Great insights into the Effective Communication stuff. It will be green soon. 

[ch6k0r]

Thank you for the insights guys, the forum community makes you feel heard in these last months with all the demotivating system changes.

[priyank_mod]

On 7/25/2024 at 10:16 PM, mateusbl said:

I guess Fiverr forgot we are Freelancers who work alone, I know some sellers who work in almost 100 orders monthly. I just wanna know how they will be able to answers new clients, current clients, message them many times asking feedback, keep them posted about progress, work on projects, revisions.

Fiverr expect to much of Freelancers, we are not a team or an agency,

Most of them are teams for real - some of them even specify in their bio that "we are a dedicated team of XYZ...."!!

But algorithm favours their conversion rate and average delivery duration to provide them higher visibility and consistent business. It is literally a loop which allows them to finance their teams too. 

[yasemin_79]

I can’t see my success score at all. Anyone had the same issue, customer support don’t answer me correct so I got confused. 

[ch6k0r]

On 8/1/2024 at 7:42 AM, yasemin_79 said:

I can’t see my success score at all. Anyone had the same issue, customer support don’t answer me correct so I got confused. 

Have you tried on desktop?

[simonjonesmusic]

On 8/1/2024 at 7:42 AM, yasemin_79 said:

I can’t see my success score at all. Anyone had the same issue, customer support don’t answer me correct so I got confused. 

Yasemin, it doesn't have enough data yet to calculate it. By the time it does, that cancelled order is going to ruin it anyway.

Take my advice - ignore it.

Use Fiverr as a stepping stone to build your portfolio and then take that portfolio and use it to kickstart yourself on the other freelancing platform(s).

These scores and metrics will be a constant obstacle that will in no way reflect the reality or merit of your work or customer engagement.

[Kesha]

Hi there!

In addition to the insights from your peers, I wanted to share this great resource that may help you improve in that area.

It is our communication hub, which contains lots of detailed information and templates to help you level up your communication. You can check it out here.

[ch6k0r]

20 hours ago, Kesha said:

Hi there!

In addition to the insights from your peers, I wanted to share this great resource that may help you improve in that area.

It is our communication hub, which contains lots of detailed information and templates to help you level up your communication. You can check it out here.

Hello Kesha, I'm happy to see you! Thank you for your attention to this topic.

I was wondering, if I start implementing these templates and tips, when can I expect to see my score improve? From what I can tell, my score seems to be fixed since the update was announced. This might be due to the large number of orders I've had in the past, but it's a bit demotivating and very stressful that no matter what I've done in the past 6 months, I haven't been able to improve my score. The stats that were previously not visible to us as freelancers made it challenging, as we could only judge our performance by the old level criteria, which I always made sure to keep at a top level. In fact, it even got me to be handpicked as a top seller for a while.

Thank you again. I want you to know that your help would be greatly appreciated and reassuring for a seller who has been providing services exclusively on Fiverr since 2015.