Charge-backs hurt more then you know

[ardicus]

Hello to all the buyers out there.



I understand that as a buyer you like to get what you order and sometimes if you don’t approve you go for a charge back with Paypal or your credit card company. (Or for some reasons you expect to get things for free.



What ever your mindset is please take note. When you do this you severely hurt people other then Fiverr. Fiverr already takes $1 per every $5 a seller makes as their part for hosting an awesome site for others to make money. So sellers only make $4 for a basic gig.



I know this doesn’t seem like much to some of you, but for us sellers its everything. Hence why we add gig extras and provide what we can for you sometimes giving more then what is expected. This can get into our personal and family times effecting us in more ways then you as a buyer can imagine. To include late night work to ensure deliveries are met, skipping family time to ensure quality is given, missing out on some opportunities to make that buck.



Lets take a look at how a charge-back effects a seller as Fiverr takes the funds back from them:

1. A charge-back for a $5 gig takes a $5 gig to replace.
   
   -Most of the time its the same amount of time and easy to come back from
   
   
2. A charge-back for a $30 gig takes SIX $5 gigs to fix. (This could take an extra 2,5,6 hours even DAYS to recover from for some people)
   
   
   
3. A $100 charge-back makes it near impossible for someone to make make money at all as it would take TWENTY $5 gigs which for some people is HOURS AND HOURS if not WEEKS of work because somebody decided to do a charge-back.
   
   
   
   All this because you as a buyer felt the need for a charge-back for what ever reason was in your mind.
   
   
   
   My suggestion for you is to take a look at what Fiverr is and what the sellers life may be like which is understandably hard not knowing them. They are trying to provide you a service and in some cases trying to make a living by doing so.
   
   A seller is effected the most as they are the ones to suffer for a charge-back not Fiverr.
   
   
   
   So please, what ever your reasoning is, take a second look at how much more you are hurting people other then Fiverr.
   
   
   
   Many sellers are here for some of the following:
   
   -A little extra cash
   
   -Disabled and this provides a means for extra income
   
   -Supporting their family on fiver sells
   
   -Planning events using fiverr (weddings, ceremonies, recognition, etc.)
   
   -Paying their way through School
   
   
   
   Buyers have a reason for everything they do and need, this is the same for sellers. So please think twice before wanting to submit for a charge-back that can hurt more then you know.
   

[muradbougraine]

I really loving your post and as a seller I can tell you a lot of buyers like to take the service for free and they success with Charge-backs.

[mgjohn78]

Its not just losing time and potential income that you have to make up for, you also need to make up for any expenses used to work on the gig, office rent, fuel spent to get to the office, electricity, and materials used to complete the gig.

[fonthaunt]

Thanks for writing this @ardicus. No matter the seller level, as you mentioned, none of us would be here if we weren’t in need of the funds. Many of us do get the wonder of doing something you love with yourself as a boss, but also need the money to live on or saving for critical things.



Buyers often write in the Rants forum. If their sellers really conned them or flaked out, I can’t blame them a bit for filing a mutual cancellation. I see buyers often that write about their anger at Fiverr for deciding that the seller DID deliver and did try their best. Those buyers want to do damage back to Fiverr so they file a credit card or PayPal charge back. They really seem to think that Fiverr will be badly hurt by the loss of $4 on a $20 order. Fiverr is rich by the standards of most of us. Instead it is the guy who needed the $16 for groceries who is badly hurt, and Fiverr writes off their $4 on some tax thing.

[ardicus]

Luckily I have a good incoming with fiverr, but for others. One charge back can change things drastically. I am writing this as I’m out with my family at a restaurant and just to think about how many people that this affects on a daily basis it’s ridiculous.

[socialmarketear]

After reading much, this whole thread is assuming buyers are scammer. You have to take note that not all seller are delivering quality in their work and some are scammer themselves. It would be much safer to say this to bring light in support both sides without any biasm or sympathy for one side no matter how bad the situation is.

[ardicus]

Reply to @socialmarketear:

socialmarketear said: After reading much, this whole thread is assuming buyers are scammer.

That isn't what this is about at all. I am simply stating a fact of what happens when a buyer does a charge-back nothing more.

The discussion on scamming from both buyers and sellers is for another post not this one.

[socialmarketear]

ardicus said: about at all

 

That's the point, that it isn't supporting both sides but rather telling people to feel sympathetic when doing a chargeback as if the buyer doesn't have a choice but whether they were scammed or delivered a poor work to them, doing a chargeback can hurt the seller even if they deserve it for being a horrible seller. I don't tend to agree with such one sided thing that's why I said to state that some sellers aren't legitimate sellers as well. Your whole post is the presumption that sellers are innocent.

[ardicus]

Reply to @socialmarketear:



Ah i see your point here. and its a valid one with concern. I am both a seller and buyer here… obviously the majority for me is selling.



But in all fairness It wasn’t meant to come across as being sympathetic. instead to bring awareness to buyers that do charge backs, to consider the other options available for the legit ones out there.

On a side note:



If a seller delivers poorly and not to your expectations, you can give them poor ratings or submit a cancellation. this hurts them more on the level of ratings and not the level financially.



Some sellers may just have a bad moment and deliver sub par work for what they can actually do. Heck I have done it, and offered to fix it hence the modification option and got a rating repaired. Mutual cancellations work best in this case.



But to straight up do a charge back is just wrong in my book. If it was wrong to begin with, a buyer should let the seller know to give them a chance to rectify it or offer a mutual cancellation.



Charge-backs In My opinion is a poor way to handle it. and thus the original post I stand behind. It hurts more then a buyer can realize or the buyer just doesnt care personally and wants free stuff to begin with. Try the other options available not go one or two months down the road AFTER the delivery, and claim to get your money back.



So it all comes down to a BUYER and how that buyer tries to control or manipulate (in some cases) the situation without concern to the work that was or can be put into a gig being sold on fiverr.

[johnt707]

Reply to @socialmarketear:



“You have to take note that not all seller are delivering quality in their work”



So, chargebacks are justifiable if the seller’s work isn’t high enough quality for the buyer? I think that’s the place for reviews. You can’t walk out of a restaurant without paying if you don’t like the food. I don’t see why Fiverr should be an exception.

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[socialmarketear]

Reply to @johnt707:



I don’t know about you but if I were to walk up to a store with a flyer that says “Best Painting Ever” and to pay and walk in to see a stick figure picture taking a crap… I would want my money back. You’re also missing the bigger picture, that is chargeback when necessary and all sellers aren’t honest with their work or promises. You can’t just nitpick and then proceed to imply justification for no chargeback.

[ardicus]

Reply to @socialmarketear:

Well normally I and any normal person would ask for my money back prior to a chargeback. Otherwise I would inform them that if there is no refund …in this case… mutual cancelation… I would do a chargeback.

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Bottom line - two different businesses here.. Fiverr chargebacks affect the seller no matter the case in reasoning behind it. If a buyer does it on fiverr, they are hurting the seller on a massive level compared to just requesting a cancellation from the get go, or allowing the seller to rectify any issues.

So back to the purpose of this post. If a buyer is so set to do a chargeback instead of working other angles available within the first couple days of receiving the order, then he/she is just being a inconsiderate person in that case. Straight and simple. There is a 3 day window after delivery for a reason, and not responding in those three days falls on the buyer for not communicating.

I am not saying to have sympathies with sellers as I know there are those out there that just cant do a good job right. But taking the chargeback route is cheap and selfish for a buyer to do intentional or not.

There are those buyers who abuse the system and sadly get away with it, getting the service for free essentially. So bias plays a role same as a buyer claiming that a seller can also scam.. bias goes both ways and targets everyone.

The main point here is to look at the outcome of a chargeback on fiverr, rather then say what we would do elsewhere.

Fiverr chargebacks = bad juju either way you view it and no matter the reasoning behind it.

[robinfg]

All good and well, but what about the buyer who has paid for half a book and the illustrator decides to cancel because he wants more money. Sorry, but if he quits I’m out the money and pictures that have been delivered as I must get a new illustrator to start once again from the beginning. You better believe that I will contact Pay Pal and dispute the charges. I don’t pay for things I can’t use. Nothing personal, just business!