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Does anyone else have buyers who always say 'if this works out well, I'll order more from you in the future' ๐Ÿ˜†


ewangraphics
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And they almost never do! I find it funny more than anything.

All of my clients are happy with their delivery, I make sure of it and ask if any changes are necessary. They leave great feedback along side a 5 star review and they never order again. I'm not annoyed by it, I just don't know why so many buyers say it as if they're worried I'm not going to work with them at all if there's no possibility of future work.

The wonders of Fiverr ๐Ÿ˜…

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4 hours ago, ewangraphics said:

I just don't know why so many buyers say it as if they're worried I'm not going to work with them at all if there's no possibility of future work.

As a seller - I don't like to hear this because it often seems like a manipulation tactic to get me to work for reduced rates.

However, when I buy, I'm just thinking about the projects that I have. It's easier working with one seller than trying to vet and qualify a new seller every time. Soย I have to catch myself every time because I almost say that to the sellers that I work with. Now I just think it in my head. If it works out, then I'll order more from this seller.

Some buyers seem to disappear, only to pop up many, many months later. It can take a while for them to get their next project for you.

Edited by vickieito
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Happened quite a few times, but its mostly cheap talk to put pressure on the seller to prioritize their work. It can be safely ignored.

It makes no difference if the buyer says they will order much more in the future, what counts is your consistency with all your buyers, not matter what.ย 

If you deliver a great quality, they will eventually come back. (If they need the service again, they will think of you and not risk going with a new seller they dont know)

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If you stick to your guns and deliver good enough stuff, the buyer might even offer more work and more money.
(This is from a conversation with a seller I would end up ordering several times, after the third delivery when I had a good enough idea of what I would be getting.)

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Edited by moikchap
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20 hours ago, ewangraphics said:

I find it funny more than anything.

Its mostly a cheap strategy to lure a seller in for a cheaper price. I dont buy it, i dont like to hear it. Sometimes i dont take their current job just because they said those things.ย 

Im really selective about the jobs. I only take the ones im sure im gonna nail it and enjoy doing it.(Thats why im at the low end of avarage at the completed number of jobs compared to the time i have been on fiverr) I know they will like my drawings, i can assume that they will order again if it turns out like i planned. But hearing that from them, that really rustles my jimmies.

rustle.jpg.e9415c0c483c038ca63a34d114db7bab.jpg

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On 9/5/2022 at 4:28 PM, ewangraphics said:

All of my clients are happy with their delivery, I make sure of it and ask if any changes are necessary. They leave great feedback along side a 5 star review and they never order again.

Same story here. There are very less repeat buyers for me on fiverr.

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I am only a buyer on Fiverr and perhaps I can give a different perspective on this. Since otherwise this post will become just a circle jerk of agreement it seems and less of insightful reflection upon oneself. First off, what I notice is a deep seeded (might be reading this too harshly or deeply) hatred or disrespect almost for your potential buyers or clients. When you have people speaking about buyers being kings and you artists or whatever you provide as dogs. Well then that is already clouding your perception or at least giving you (me) in insight as to how you perceive those around you but also yourself and your willingness to put up with bad behavior. Let alone the audacity after you the seller delivered work for them the buyer not following up or through on the option or perhaps even promise to buy more (bit hyperbolic but you should catch my drift). This sounds to me as incredibly privileged and removing oneself from the equation simply blaming it on the buyer.

1. No money: Something went wrong, dog sick, car broke down, a million other reasons a buyer cannot follow up on an initial promise. Dealing with this is not fun and most often will lead to ghosting as it's not fun to deal with. Bad behavior yes but reality nonetheless.

2. Honesty: Sometimes (my own experience) I get delivered artwork that is like 80% there but I can see that this is the max the artist can do or provide, there is little use to squeeze them until they either quit or I ask unrealistic things from them. Going through multiple revisions is tedious (language issues) and often time consuming. What I tend to do is simply thank the artist, give a 5 star review and move on. No hassle no fuss, I have to say I never had an artist themselves come up to me and say "oh btw when can I start the next work" so often they may themselves feel like they have failed. No one (normal or reasonable) likes leaving a bad review intentionally without it being able to work out behind the scenes through mutual cancellation or paying and taking the loss. I am in agreement though that bad actors can really put sellers through the ringer on Fiverr if they so desire or wish. That's I suppose the downside of sites like these. As from a business standpoint Fiverr will side with the buyer 95% of the time same with Ebay will also side as otherwise no one would be selling anything as there are too many possible bad actors on each side. You can only hope the good guys rise above the shitty ones.

3. Skill level: Overestimating the amount of children's book artists who have replied to my requests saying yes I can do your creative semi realistic non anime character in a painterly style without issue, is an issue of itself. Look, everyone starts somewhere and that is awesome and good. However I have to say setting yourself up for failure and a bad experience is another one all together.

4. Fraud: The amount of stolen artwork that people use to promote their gigs is insane. I am more than adept at reverse image search at this point to verify if the proposed artwork is theirs, no other account such as behance, insta or other to verify overall portfolio of artwork is also a dead give away. It is imo a huge problem and drowns out so many good actors I rather not contemplate it.

5. False advertisement or reverse shenanigans: Portofolio is verifiable and looks great, correct anatomy, coloring etc etc. When you hire them and get your delivery you receive 50% of the quality from the portfolio "yeah but if you want portfolio quality work the price suddenly is X amount". (sometimes double or triple) Which is fine but also sets up the wrong expectations towards buyers. Again while we may say "yeah but I don't do that '' I can say yes this happens more than you think.ย 

My project is a RPG sourcebook that I am working on and for it I work with creature blocks. These blocks consist of a particular group of creatures, let's say devils for instance, these blocks are 4-8 orders ranging from minion to mini-boss or boss. I like therefore to have consistency throughout this artwork, ergo the same artist that works on that particular block as otherwise you may end up with vastly different styles. I will always mention there might be more orders coming if the first one goes well for a couple of reasons.

1. Availability: I will run into issues if 2 orders in an artist have not enough time or issues. Hence I need to wait egregiously long or might even have to scrap those expenditures as the artist themselves vanish or can't continue with the work.

2. Motivation: I would assume you'd want to be selling here, a buyer willing or optioning (emphasizes on the optioning) for more possible orders should signal to a person to put their best leg forward. While many will say "yeah but I am always doing that". I will respond simply with this "no, sorry I am a human being, I know myself well enough and others through life experiences and though I and my fellow humans try their best sometimes it doesn't work, pan out, or any viable excuse you can place here works" adding stakes is nothing wrong with accept when the aforementioned reason is raised to cheapskate for lesser payout. That's bad practice on the buyer's end and should not be accepted by the seller.

3. Trials: When I am not sure of an artist I will often trial them they can choose a creature block to work on and they get reimbursed fully for it. Often the work is good but far from what they either promote or use on their profile. There is so so so much on fiverr in the sense of stolen artwork or simply personal portfolio work being used as an example only for it to be then way less quality. What I most often will do is take the "loss" a.k.a pay and move on unless I feel like I am being cheated with the quality the profile or gig advertises against what I am receiving. Cause I don't like leaving low reviews on people that tried but either failed, couldn't live up to my expectations or regarded their skill level extremely higher than realistically possible. I suggest making a request to place some decent artwork and you'll see what offers come flooding in saying they can do X, Y or Z and when I watch their portfolios I wonder to myself "there is no way in hell this is going to work out ever".

So yeah sorry for my wall of text that I don't think many will read. There is a lot of stuff that has to be taken into account on the buyer's end as well. Similar but different frustrations go each way in so these are my couple of cents coming from some who have 132 successful orders and 10 cancellations, many of which I never returned to as I, A. Did not want to hurt their feelings B. Tried their very best but were not good enough for the final product C. Did not work out for other reasons. So yeah we are all human, most often insecure and fallible

Edited by kosmtheandric
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On 9/5/2022 at 1:58 PM, ewangraphics said:

And they almost never do! I find it funny more than anything.

ย 

I think everyone does. And just like most sellers, this kind of stuff rubs me the wrong way too. It shows there won't be any new order and they just want to squeeze everything they can right now...

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@kosmtheandricWelcome to the forum! You and I basically do the same thing. I'm creating RPG content as well (though I'm more focused on what could be simplified as "one page adventures"), buying a lot of art and a little writing.

1 hour ago, kosmtheandric said:

First off, what I notice is a deep seeded (might be reading this too harshly or deeply) hatred or disrespect almost for your potential buyers or clients.

There are other vibes as well. There's also a permeating belief that quality can only be obtained from expensive sellers as if correlation is causation. You might also see yourself dismissed as a "hobbyist" due to not operating a traditional business. But, in my assessment, it's less an inherent buyer/seller dynamic and is actually more like classism. You're more likely to encounter prejudice from "top of the category" type sellers than you are from the main line/front of the shop sellers.

For your five "no follow-up purchase" reasons, I encountered 2/3 a lot. 2 typically impacts the schedule rather than the delivery. Possibly, the specifics of my requests have been causing the fraudsters to reject my offers, so I haven't run into 4 many times (though I did run into one using stock art as components). I get annoyed by a 5 style issue, in that the gig seems to only include images that would be their top tier. They present no sample of what their low tier option results in, and that's when I get some stuff way below what's expected.

For your three "may mention if" reasons, when I do it, it's mainly 3. I'm intentionally paying people to audition, expecting most of them won't work out. I _want_ to be able to dump a stack of specs on a single artist so I can sign them all off at once. Tracking what all pieces are needing spec, offer pending, offer accepted, delivered etc is a pain. I like variety in art, but it's too much management burden to not use some people repeatedly.

Hope your book does well! What platform are you going to use? (DM's Guild, DriveThruRPG, Patreon, Kickstarter, Itch.io's book section?)

ย 

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@moikchap The book is an oversized hobby project that may or may not see the light of day. I've certainly learned that when you do, world building, races, classes, monsters, quests, map design etc all by yourself its a time consuming process to say the least. In regards to where I will try to publish a kickstarter when its ready, doesn't have to be succesful just get it out and see what happens. Followed by release on DriveThruRPG, DM's Guild is terrible system of release as it means you auto forfeit all your rights to D&D without possibility of royalty creditation or anything. They can simply joink your idea or bits of it publish it and call it theirs and they would be well in their rights to do so. The idea that someone posts there is ridiclious from a law and rights standpoint. That's not to say if your encredibly succesfull and have a great couple of books you'll be making enough money I suppose to not let that be a detriment. Though I would never surrunder my ideas so easily for only an accesible storefront.

In regards to other vibes the way how I am reading this, is that from some posters there is a extermly dismissive and or negative mindset to potential clients. Now written words can be hard to decipher in regards to intent and meaning but you cannot argue with someone who writes the following

Quote

I think everyone does. And just like most sellers, this kind of stuff rubs me the wrong way too. It shows there won't be any new order and they just want to squeeze everything they can right now...

That they are so burned by the Fiverr or the industry that if this is the initial response well, that's a bad negative mindset, starting point and a few other issues that someone might wish to address first instead of projecting it to the buyer by mere assumption when they say "hey if everything goes well there is a possibility for more orders''. I just wanted to give my two cents before this post turned into a circle jerk of "Yeah I agree sellers are bad and call it a day". My experience is if your mindset or starting point is lacking you receive what you attract most of the time. If you have no spine to tell someone who tries to pressure, negotiate you into lower your price that's a problem with you, not the one trying to do so. Again it's rude and mean but at the end of the day if someone is using their money trying to hire someone you decide what your own time is worth. If you do the work for less money for any reason you have no rights to cry about it, beyond looking in the mirror for the problem. Yes I know how harsh and mean that sounds, but I am afraid that's unfortunately how most people are and act.ย 

In regard to expensive sellers are the best sellers no, I have to agree with you, my best artists are relatively the cheapest. So it's true that expensive does not equal faster, better, or a more pleasant experience. I rather use google translate to get a great artist who struggles with language and attaining gig's to give a decent shot then the one who has 14 orders pending and attempts to cram me in there somewhere cause money and the artpiece gets half the attention. While quality is always a thing if an good artist get's me 90% of my idea there I am good if person that does 100% costs double or triple I am good with the 90% person. At some point quality and expenditure do need to make sense.

Edited by kosmtheandric
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@kosmtheandricย I read your post here and think you have some exceptionally valid points. You actually echo quite a few things that sellers complain about here, too. Well, the serious ones. We all want Fiverr to have a better reputation.

Unless I'm misunderstanding, which is quite possible, your comments are more general instead of focused specifically on the original post's complaint. Many of us have had supposed buyers promise future work specifically to get a discount or free work. The one's who say "hey if everything goes well, there is a possibility for more orders" are not who, I believe, the sellers are complaining about. It's the buyers who say "You do this for (10% of gig price or whatever). I have much more work in the future for you!" That happens quite a lot. I absolutely agree it is up to the sellers not to bend to these 'demands.' It does get tedious when it happens so frequently, though. That's what the venting posts are all about.

Both sellers AND buyers should speak out against bad business practices, scams, cheaters, etc. That's what makes Fiverr better over time, in my opinion.

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@melanielmYes and no, like all things there are 2 sides to a story.

For instance any poster here can be a well let's call them an "unpleasant individual" with bad communication skills, poor language, arrogant, entitled. It's easy to say my art is excellent and you just don't get my style. Which to some degree is correct but bad anatomy fundamentals stays bad anatomy fundamentals regardless of style. While I do not want to make this personal by any means there is always one side of the story you can see especially if these are 1 liner ish/ off hand comments. So it's very easy to "complain" about why do buyers entice artists with promises of more work or don't follow up. Well since the aforementioned reasons I explained. But it could just as well be that the seller was unpleasant and then blames the buyer for these types of issues, aka the other side of the coin/story.

While your definition/explanation I would agree with this is however not how the title of the post is laid out. As the title would be more in the line of "If you do this first order cheap or half price, more orders will follow" that would be an accurate sentence that would reflect your definition instead or the assumption you took from the title (perhaps cause this has happened to you multiple time this is how you read it). However the title we have is "if this works out well, I'll order more from you in the future" speaks nothing of less pay only that more orders will follow if the order works out well. Which is for someone who exists outside of this seller ecosystem (me, and these common or uncommon things are outside of my experience) reads this as "yeah duh, if the first order doesn't go well then why in the hell would I order more?". If I read it through your lens I would absolutely agree with you that it is an annoying practice for people to offer work at reduced rate with the insinuated promise of more in the future only for the truth to be there is no future and they simply want 1 singular piece cheap. Though I cannot read intent without proper word use hence my too long post adding some nuance xD.

Edited by kosmtheandric
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7 hours ago, kosmtheandric said:

perhaps cause this has happened to you multiple time this is how you read it

This is what happens to many of the sellers for a suprising amount. Thats why everyone is negative towards this sentence.(At leastย  i am)ย 

We all like to engage with a returning client who has a project with a continious job flow. And for some, it is an oppurtunity to say "I have done every art piece in this book/game"ย 

You might be a good buyer and a reasonable person, this does not mean we dont encounter the opposite. And quite frequently. Sometimes you can tell by their behaivor. Let me give you an example, recently happened just couple weeks ago.

A buyer comes up to me and asks for 20 character designs for their game and asks for a price. There is a price in the gig. Saying that you have 20 and asking for a price despite its there is just asking for another price, which they confirmed. Alright cool, let me see the 20 characters list. So i know what we will be doing.

Buyer sends me an example of a characer and says they want it that way. Its a female archer, and very basic background with couple tree trunks. Good. If its like that, it fits my gig price. But buyer does not send me a list. Doesnt gives me any character names or some 1 sentence explanation of the characters. I dont know if its going to be another archer, or a 10 headed dragonkin. I dont know how someone else thinks. But i expect some information about those 20 characters if i am going to give a price to them. Specially if its a discounted one. Character art is different. 10 headed dragonkin takes much much more time than a simple archer, thus making it more expensive.ย 

So, no list, not even the first characters description is shown. There is just an example of an archer drawing that have been found on the internet. Now i need to give an exact price to those? Oh how fair the world is. Anyway, i gave them a price despite all of those. Just a little less from my gig price. No order is set yet. Because i have been burned when i wasnt careful with those in my beginner times.

They have sent me the first piece. I'll exactly explain what they are asking me to draw. "2 Slingers on top of a siege tower, in the foreground armies are marching towards the castle at the background." WHAT? This is the same with that archer drawing? Yeah, they both use ranged weapons. Is that what was implied? So i will draw 20 of these Kingdom of Heaven sceneries for a price of a "discounted single character drawing"

I rejected immediately. I will not abuse myself to give a discounted price to someone who has no idea what they are talking about. I will see the jobs scale first. If there are more work in the future, show me the work. If you are not going to give me anything, i will not risk my career, my position and the future of my fiverr gigs. If someone asks for a discount and claims there are more work, yeah show me the work and we will talk.ย 

Its not always the question of "Is there really a future work?" Sometimes its also a question of "What kind of work?"

If someone claims that there are more work to be done, i need to see them. Im not just claiming im good at fantasy drawings, i have a gallery for you to judge and many more drawings to show you if you need more to see. I will not hold back about providing you examples of my works. And i expect the same thing about the works description. So if someone says "there is more in the future" and does not show me the future, it means there is no suitable future. We have got to protect our shops here. Some of us tryng to make a living here with children to look after. We cant just rely on some strangers word.

That is why people are frustrated about these sentences.

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@ozan_erdiThe only thing I can say is that you seem to have a great grasp on how to handle these situations. Though handling a client or buyer is just as much a skill as the art you produce. Albeit it a very shitty skill to train or have to use but a necessary one. I can't defend unreasonable people like you describe but I did have circumstances that even though I provided let's say 8 references for ``cthulian style monsters' ' hammering out a clear idea to an artist can be very difficult. I always approach things from "normal" and yes it sounds the same like well using "common sense" and you'll notice after dealing with 10 people common sense and normal is vastly different for everyone. You can only use yourself as a baseline ergo your own vision, rules and practices as a basis and go from there.

Quote

That is why people are frustrated about these sentences.

While I understand the above sentiment, at the end of the day it is your communication to figure out the buyer's motivation, intent and scope of work. Going from "there might be more work '' to some of you that immediately raises hairs, suspicion or anger is a problem of previous failings or really unfair harsh lessons learned most likely the hard or unfair way. Not saying that is good but well unfortunately it's the reality and immediately going to a certain place in regards to a certain word, utterance or sentence is not professional in my opinion. Because at the end of the day I and many other buyers cannot help it if you've been wronged before and to be piled up automatically into the same category of possible bad actors is a failure on your own part not ours who might actually have good intentions. Though I can understand the frustration of many bad interactions with numerous people, never let it poison the well or your perception of those you might meet. Thanks for sharing your opinion and difficulties and hardships though.

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11 minutes ago, kosmtheandric said:

Because at the end of the day I and many other buyers cannot help it if you've been wronged before

That is correct. You cant and shouldnt think about that either. Dont worry there, any experienced people here would be aware of this and still go on and try to find a solution to a buyers work request. Otherways they wouldnt be experienced and died out. There are some things you cannot see as a buyer, and some things we cannot see as a seller. Maybe you would have entcountered a seller who claimed to be the best, but isnt and you now might be more defensive about who to pick, to the point of tiring a good seller out. It might happen. These are the the situations everyone deals with

ย 

13 minutes ago, kosmtheandric said:

``cthulian style monsters' '

Well it all depends on the culture you grow into. I immediately can see what you ask. Someone else might never understand it.

ย 

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