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 Hey guys,

Yes, this has NOTHING to do with Fiverr, but it's more on the situation we're living in nowadays, COVID and VACCINES.

I live in Italy. As some of you may know, here in Europe we have GREEN PASS that allows you to do "normal things" and live a "normal life".
You get the green pass by:

  • getting vaccinated (valid for about a year)
  • the negative result of a swab test (valid for 48h)
  • recovering from COVID (valid for 6 months)

Are they imposing us to get vaccinated? Nop, but I would say they indirectly are. No GREEN PASS would mean no eating in restaurants, no public transportation, no travelling  around Europe, ecc.. and who would be willing to get tested every 2 days (and spend 90€ for each swab test?)

What are your thoughts about it? I am actually NOT against getting vaccinated, but I am always very diffident of these things, because let's be real, we do not know exactly what they contain and the long-term consequences they can have on our bodies and organism. Despite all of this, I did get vaccinated and just got my second dose.

So, what are your thoughts about it? Do you feel like the Government is subtly imposing us to get vaccinated? Do you feel like we are not getting enough freedom to choose? Feel free to express yourselves and share your opinion 🙂

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3 minutes ago, mjaninea said:

Do you feel like we are not getting enough freedom to choose?

I feel that Europe has much more freedom than where I’m based right now 😉 

we don’t have travel, airports are shut down, we can’t even go on a street without a mask, you can’t get anywhere without a tracing app that checks you in everywhere and tracing any Bluetooth connections around you, we have a limit of only 2-5 people that can get together depending on a situation even if it’s a family of 3-6 they have to separate going out etc. 
So yes, I think Europe is pretty free at the moment 🙈 

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38 minutes ago, mjaninea said:

 Hey guys,

Yes, this has NOTHING to do with Fiverr, but it's more on the situation we're living in nowadays, COVID and VACCINES.

I live in Italy. As some of you may know, here in Europe we have GREEN PASS that allows you to do "normal things" and live a "normal life".
You get the green pass by:

  • getting vaccinated (valid for about a year)
  • the negative result of a swab test (valid for 48h)
  • recovering from COVID (valid for 6 months)

Are they imposing us to get vaccinated? Nop, but I would say they indirectly are. No GREEN PASS would mean no eating in restaurants, no public transportation, no travelling  around Europe, ecc.. and who would be willing to get tested every 2 days (and spend 90€ for each swab test?)

What are your thoughts about it? I am actually NOT against getting vaccinated, but I am always very diffident of these things, because let's be real, we do not know exactly what they contain and the long-term consequences they can have on our bodies and organism. Despite all of this, I did get vaccinated and just got my second dose.

So, what are your thoughts about it? Do you feel like the Government is subtly imposing us to get vaccinated? Do you feel like we are not getting enough freedom to choose? Feel free to express yourselves and share your opinion 🙂

Do we have to talk about vaccines, again?! 

Fine. 

Yes, they are imposing vaccinations. That's obvious. By making our lives so miserable if we don't, that you end up doing it because you feel there's no other choice. I live in Spain, and we have the same green pass here. 

With all that said: I'm all for vaccinations, and I believe in the science behind vaccines. I'm fully vaccinated, not because someone told me I have to, but because I want to protect my own health. Getting vaccinated is a personal choice, and it should be a descision between you and your doctor. Not the government. Not the Fiverr forum. Not family members. This is about you and your health. 

So even though I, personally, think most people should get vaccinated, I'm not a health care professional, and the crazy politicians who are making our lives suck if we don't get the jab, aren't either. 

"We do not know exactly what they contain" just isn't correct, though. The list of ingredients are publically available and easily found on Google. That's not an excuse. But when it comes to your health down the line, it has to be up to you and your doctor. I'm not going to tell you what to do. And I don't like when the government does that, either. 

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47 minutes ago, mjaninea said:

Do you feel like we are not getting enough freedom to choose?

I live in Montana, USA and we have the freedom to choose if we want to wear a mask whether we are vaccinated or not. We can go out to eat and shop as all commercial places are open. Many places suggest that patrons wear masks if not vaccinated, but no one is at the door to enforce the request as once was done. 

That being said, the delta variant has hit our state hard in the more populated areas. My county is one of the 4 that has the most COVID cases. I am always sure to keep a six foot social distance space as much as possible and I constantly am using hand sanitizer. I also use clorox wipes to wipe down shopping carts on all parts I may touch. I do not wear a mask unless I am required too, which is in places like doctor offices. So far I have been COVID free. In fact by using the stated precautions I have not been ill since March of 2019. 

Edited by vickiespencer
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48 minutes ago, mjaninea said:

No GREEN PASS would mean no eating in restaurants, no public transportation, no travelling  around Europe, ecc..

I have no intention to eat in restaurants, use public transport (I walk or, if it's really way too far and I absolutely have to go there, take a cab) or travel until this is over, anyway. It's too risky. Stuff like that can wait.

That being said, yes, governments are definitely trying to convince people to get vaccinated.

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1 hour ago, mjaninea said:

So, what are your thoughts about it? Do you feel like the Government is subtly imposing us to get vaccinated? Do you feel like we are not getting enough freedom to choose?

I think you have a very balanced approach. The Governments are definitely all in, but that is probably because they only look at the cost side of anything. It is far cheaper for them to give you a $25 shot, as opposed to $8,000 hospital stay. So as long as they are running the numbers, there is a certain amount of death by jab that they are willing to accept. Just like when gov run healthcare tells 85 year old to go home with morphine pills and get ready to meet Jesus, instead of getting chemotherapy. 

My opinion is that I fully support anyone who wants to take the vaccine, and I fully support anyone who does not. I think a talk with one's doctor, and free choice are what should rule the day. The vaccine seems (generally safe), but there have been reports of deadly blood clots, teenagers with heart problems, etc... And the long term effects on cancer rates, birth defects and infertility are completely unknown. So the only objection I have to any of this is when people with no medical training dispense medical advice. Which you are not doing btw.  

Edited by newsmike
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13 minutes ago, smashradio said:

Do we have to talk about vaccines, again?! 

Fine. 

Yes, they are imposing vaccinations. That's obvious. By making our lives so miserable if we don't, that you end up doing it because you feel there's no other choice. I live in Spain, and we have the same green pass here. 

With all that said: I'm all for vaccinations, and I believe in the science behind vaccines. I'm fully vaccinated, not because someone told me I have to, but because I want to protect my own health. Getting vaccinated is a personal choice, and it should be a descision between you and your doctor. Not the government. Not the Fiverr forum. Not family members. This is about you and your health. 

So even though I, personally, think most people should get vaccinated, I'm not a health care professional, and the crazy politicians who are making our lives suck if we don't get the jab, aren't either. 

"We do not know exactly what they contain" just isn't correct, though. The list of ingredients are publically available and easily found on Google. That's not an excuse. But when it comes to your health down the line, it has to be up to you and your doctor. I'm not going to tell you what to do. And I don't like when the government does that, either. 

Thanks for sharing your opinion and experience. I fully agree with you, getting vaccinated should be a personal choice. I myself am not against vaccinations (like what I said, I am fully vaccinated), rather, I am against MANDATORY VACCINATION.

The list of ingredients is available on Google, true, but I myself do not know what those ingredients are and their long-term effect on my body. We all know all medications have their side effect.

 

 

20 minutes ago, vickiespencer said:

I live in Montana, USA and we have the freedom to choose if we want to wear a mask whether we are vaccinated or not. We can go out to eat and shop as all commercial places are open. Many places suggest that patrons wear masks if not vaccinated, but no one is at the door to enforce the request as once was done. 

That being said, the delta variant has hit our state hard in the more populated areas. My county is one of the 4 that has the most COVID cases. I am always sure to keep a six foot social distance space as much as possible and I constantly am using hand sanitizer. I also use clorox wipes to wipe down shopping carts on all parts I may touch. I do not wear a mask unless I am required too, which is in places like doctor offices. So far I have been COVID free. In fact by using the stated precautions I have not been ill since March of 2019. 

Thanks Vickie for sharing your experience! I am surprised that you don't have the same restrictions as we have here in Italy, I didn't know that! Good to hear that you are COVID free and have not been ill for such a long time now!

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25 minutes ago, smashradio said:

"We do not know exactly what they contain" just isn't correct, though. The list of ingredients are publically available and easily found on Google. That's not an excuse.

True. We just have no idea what the side effects, long term will be. That's is what concerns me. Unlike every other vaccine, this didn't even go through animal trials. We are the test. 

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Hungary went back to 'normal' in mid-June if I recall well (it was right after my birthday, so probably around that time!) We don't need to wear masks anymore (even in closed-off spaces and yesterday a politician said they aren't intending to change this - I'm going out of country again in two weeks so I'm not sure how that'll go but so far all is good.

Do I agree with this? Not necessarily because the people who refuse the vaccine will continue to do so (and quite frankly it's not mandatory for a reason, so it's not like they can be forced to do so) so we never know who might not have proper immunity. I'm fully vaccinated but (we assume) caught the virus in Malta a few weeks (almost a month ago now) back, it felt like a really bad cold (but not worse than most I've had), the only reason we suspected it is because someone I shared a room with testes positive, so... Could have been anything (by the way I could have been tested I was fine 😄)
All in all the places I've been to this year were strictish (France you needed both vaccinations to get into Disney, Malta required both even to just visit and so on) but I can understand that tourism-wise. Completely limiting their citizens (like Slovenia is doing now (the news said you can't even go to a gas station without the green pass? I don't know if that's true but it was on TV so...) is probably not going to work out long term though...

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6 minutes ago, newsmike said:

My opinion is that I fully support anyone who wants to take the vaccine, and I fully support anyone who does not. I think a talk with one's doctor, and free choice are what should rule the day. The vaccine seems (generally safe), but there have been reports of deadly blood clots, teenagers with heart problems, etc... And the long term effects on cancer rates, birth defects and infertility are completely unknown. so the only objection I have to any of this is when people with no medical training dispense medical advice. Which you are not doing btw.  

Exactly what I was trying to point out. I am just pissed at the media and the Government for not being fair with the news. Here in Italy, when someone dies because of COVID, the media always specifies that those people were not vaccinated. I have heard reports of deadly blood clots, teenagers with heart problems too, but the media hardly ever talks about it and when it does, they say that it is in no way connected to the vaccine, which I doubt.

With this, I am not trying to scare anyone. I am fully vaccinated and thank God I am doing good, but I have to admit that I was really scared of taking it and still have no idea of its future effects. I just don't really like how they are subtly imposing vaccines. We should be able to choose what's best for ourselves.

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2 minutes ago, mjaninea said:

but the media hardly ever talks about it and when it does, they say that it is in no way connected to the vaccine, which I doubt.

The main-stream media is corrupt. Without getting into politics too much, every news channel used to have giant "death tickers" running constantly to scare everyone about the death tolls of COVID. That ended the day after the election here in US, still not there. The same uncurious media that only repeats talking points supplied to them. Now all we get is government sponsored announcements telling us all to take the jab, and unlike every other medicine advertised, there are no side effects listed. 

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8 minutes ago, mjaninea said:

I am fully vaccinated and thank God I am doing good, but I have to admit that I was really scared of taking it and still have no idea of its future effects.

This is where I am at. I have had the first two jabs, because at my age the thought of risking COVID scared me. On the other hand my hubby got COVID and even with his diabetes and heart condition did well with it. Also, my 90-year-old dad got COVID and did not get too sick either. But then the lady who cuts my hair lost her 50-year-old apparently healthy husband to COVID so it is a mystery as to who will die and who will not from having the sickness. 

That being said, I will not be getting the delta variant booster. 

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2 hours ago, mjaninea said:

Do you feel like the Government is subtly imposing us to get vaccinated?

I'm living in Italy too and yes, I totally feel that they're pushing us. I'm generally pro vaccines but I'm not for imposing them. To me, health is a individual responsibility, some people have diseases not listed for an exemption but are they still at risk. No one talks about them, instead the government's really pushing on Green Pass, extending it to various categories of workers. Also, I don't like the psychological terrorism that television is putting on, glossing over the problems people had with the jab and emphasizing how hospitals are filling up with unvaccinated.
These behaviours generate only confusion and little confidence in the scientific community.

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1 hour ago, catwriter said:

I have no intention to eat in restaurants, use public transport (I walk or, if it's really way too far and I absolutely have to go there, take a cab) or travel until this is over, anyway. It's too risky. Stuff like that can wait.

This seems a bit like "I don't want to do something, so I don't care if other people lose their freedom" to me. 

What if I want to take the risk of eating in restaurants, use public transport, or travel? 

49 minutes ago, newsmike said:

The main-stream media is corrupt. Without getting into politics too much, every news channel used to have giant "death tickers" running constantly to scare everyone about the death tolls of COVID. That ended the day after the election here in US, still not there. The same uncurious media that only repeats talking points supplied to them. Now all we get is government sponsored announcements telling us all to take the jab, and unlike every other medicine advertised, there are no side effects listed. 

I agree that the side-effects should be listed. I find it just as strange as you. I wouldn't go as far as calling the "mainstream media" corrupt. As a journalist, I've written tons of articles on the vaccines for "mainstream media". I never once just regurgitated what the government put out. I always look at the facts, and then do my best to represent all sides of an argument. I believe most journalists do the same. We're not some robots who just keep churcning out government talking points: we do talk about the government talking points, yes, because the people should know what their government is up to. If you chose to distrust those talking points, that's up to you. But with all that said, there's no doubt in my mind that all journalism is (and should be) colored by opinions. Part of my integrity when I write an article, is exactly that: I'm not going to put something out there that I don't agree with - and if I do - I will make it damn clear that it's not my view, but someone elses opinion on the matter. 

Then it's up to you, the viewer/reader, to decide which side/argument/opinion you want to believe. 

That's all generally speaking, of course. The mainstream media is no different from the blogs, opinionated podcasts and other media out there: the corporations often have a certain view on a matter. For instance, I would say FOX is conservative/right leaning, while CNN or The Post is left leaning, and so on. And I'm totally fine with it, because I watch them both to form an opinion myself. 

I think everyone should do the same. And I think we should have the freedom to do so, without being punished or discredited for making different choices than other people. The vaccines are a perfect example of how society has split: one half is being ridiculed for not doing what the other side says they should. I find that to be quite disgusting. When did we stop being individuals? 

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2 hours ago, mjaninea said:

So, what are your thoughts about it? 

None.. neutral since we are dealing with an invisible enemy here, one that we know little to nothing about (at least non-scientists).. so can't decide what is right or wrong anymore..

2 hours ago, mjaninea said:

Do you feel like the Government is subtly imposing us to get vaccinated?

Not sure.. maybe, maybe not..

2 hours ago, mjaninea said:

Do you feel like we are not getting enough freedom to choose?

Not sure again

2 hours ago, mjaninea said:

Feel free to express yourselves and share your opinion 🙂

Ya just did.. appreciate the opportunity.. 

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1 minute ago, newsmike said:

When virtue signaling on social media became a hobby of most simple minded folks. The mob mentality is disgusting. 

Indeed. I don't know if you're a sci-fi fan, but there's an episode of The Orville who tackles this really well. In it, people are sentenced to a brainwash if they get enough downvotes. Believe it was Season 1, episode 7. 

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17 minutes ago, smashradio said:

I believe most journalists do the same. We're not some robots who just keep churcning out government talking points

I am talking about "Big Media" The cabal of CNN, MSNBC, even FOX to a great extent, Wash post, NYT, etc. The folks with 99% of the reach, are all stenographers for the gov.  I believe that you do write what you say, but it ain't gonna be on page 1 of the NYT.

Plus there is the censorship partnership which includes social media. Remember when just using the word "hydroxychloroquine" would get you a warning or an outright ban on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter....  Today India is claiming that Ivermectin has been the med that has virtually eradicated COVID, and not 1 second of coverage from any MSM outlet. You have to go to the many small, independent (the 1%) of sources to find anything like this. So, I will stand by the fact that whatever is on your TV is most likely corrupt, edited and approved by some political editor somewhere. 

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/09/huge-uttar-pradesh-india-announces-state-covid-19-free-proving-effectiveness-deworming-drug-ivermectin/

https://www.theburningplatform.com/2021/08/14/indias-ivermectin-blackout/

https://covid.us.org/2021/06/27/ivermectin-use-in-india/

https://newsrescue.com/the-undeniable-ivermectin-miracle-indias-240m-populated-largest-state-uttar-pradesh-horowitz/

 

Then browse the same issue on the MSM sites, and you get a bunch of this:

image.thumb.png.a31581800e2d7302ff520cf040126278.png

 

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1 hour ago, newsmike said:

Unlike every other vaccine, this didn't even go through animal trials.

I've heard that they did go through animal trials (and clinical trials on humans).

1 hour ago, vickiespencer said:

That being said, I will not be getting the delta variant booster. 

We'll be getting it as soon as we're invited.

 

39 minutes ago, smashradio said:

This seems a bit like "I don't want to do something, so I don't care if other people lose their freedom" to me. 

Sorry, I didn't mean it to sound like that, just that it wouldn't bother me personally even if I wasn't vaccinated.

40 minutes ago, smashradio said:

What if I want to take the risk of eating in restaurants, use public transport, or travel? 

If you were risking just your own health/life, that would be up to you, but wouldn't you (potentially) endanger others, too? Considering that even vaccinated people can get infected and infect others (which sort of makes the covid pass weird, I mean, how much does it really help to prevent infections)?

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23 minutes ago, newsmike said:

I am talking about "Big Media" The cabal of CNN, MSNBC, even FOX to a great extent, Wash post, NYT, etc. The folks with 99% of the reach, are all stenographers for the gov.  I believe that you do write what you say, but it ain't gonna be on page 1 of the NYT.

Plus there is the censorship partnership which includes social media. Remember when just using the word "hydroxychloroquine" would get you a warning or an outright ban on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter....  Today India is claiming that Ivermectin has been the med that has virtually eradicated COVID, and not 1 second of coverage from any MSM outlet. You have to go to the many small, independent (the 1%) of sources to find anything like this. So, I will stand by the fact that whatever is on your TV is most likely corrupt, edited and approved by some political editor somewhere. 

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/09/huge-uttar-pradesh-india-announces-state-covid-19-free-proving-effectiveness-deworming-drug-ivermectin/

https://www.theburningplatform.com/2021/08/14/indias-ivermectin-blackout/

https://covid.us.org/2021/06/27/ivermectin-use-in-india/

https://newsrescue.com/the-undeniable-ivermectin-miracle-indias-240m-populated-largest-state-uttar-pradesh-horowitz/

 

Then browse the same issue on the MSM sites, and you get a bunch of this:

image.thumb.png.a31581800e2d7302ff520cf040126278.png

 

I believe social media is more to blame than the big media. I'm not saying the governments aren't influencing the media, I'm just saying that the media is in large part built on journalists doing their job. It might look like a machine, but usually, it's one or two journalists working on a story, and it gets published by the big media. I don't think it's all corrupt. But it most certainly is influenced by any number of political viewpoints. 

I think the "independent" media out there are just as "bad" as big media. They all have some agenda, and usually, it's readership. Spreading fear isn't just something the governments are doing; the media earns a buttload of money when people are scared. That's their motivation, most of the time. Sure, it can also be political, but mostly, it's about you and me clicking their story. That's what matters to the "big media" and the independent media. And they all use scare tacticts to achieve it. Fear is money. 

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