Would you welcome a paid Fiverr membership (as a seller)?

[moikchap]

Taking a quick skim of my inbox, I currently have 23 sellers I'm giving repeat business to. The highest national representation is 6 of those sellers being from Indonesia. According to numbeo, a 1 bedroom apartment in the center of the national capitol (Jakarta) is about 475 USD. The individual seller I've given the highest number of orders is in the Ukraine, where a 1 bedroom apartment in the center of the national capitol (Kyiv) is about 575 USD. The individual seller I've paid the most is in Lithuania, where an apartment of that type in Vilnius is about 625 USD.

If we want an analogy, a similar apartment in Washington DC is $2325. So, it's possible, for those sellers, the impact of asking for 250/mo might be like asking an American for $1,000/mo.

I doubt those sellers would be here for me to work with if that kind of fee was there. It would instead be sellers with higher prices trying to recover the cost of the monthly fee. Likely, this would put prices outside my budget. As a result, I possibly would not be here either.

Personally, I've accepted that there's a lot of sellers which are a waste of money. I spend the money to get them to do the work and verify for sure. The upside of always rolling the dice is that I've also found a lot of excellent sellers who were sitting there at 0 reviews, 0 orders in queue, who were cutting discounts to get growth. Many of them have since gone on to increase their prices and consistently have orders in queue.

The solution to filtering bad and good, for the benefit of buyers as a whole, might be more functions which help buyers like me run this "paid audition" process more easily and cheaply. I got VID recently, and it feel kind of like it could do that, but the coupon seem to want me to make larger single orders instead of place orders with new sellers. Giving me coupons to reduce the risk of trying out new sellers would enable me to manually verify who is good and who isn't.

[lenasemenkova]

I wouldn’t want that to happen but we’re getting there. 

I watched it slowly (agonisingly slowly) getting implemented on that other platform we don’t talk about. The selling model is different but it went from free-to-play to somewhat free-to-play to pay or just sit there staring at your profile page. 

The signs are there. I'll complain for a while and then pay up. 

PS Weeee, I'm a newbie with 2817 posts. Good to know.

Edited June 27, 2021 by lenasemenkova

[genuineguidance]

No. I would not welcome a "paid membership" on Fiverr.

I have been here since 2013, sold stuff for $5 at first, have paid my dues, give them 20% of my earnings, deal with cancellations or those who want to charge back from time to time (meaning I don't get paid), and follow their rules so my stats stay in a healthy area so I keep my level here.

$250 a month is probably peanuts for someone who sells Gigs for hundreds if not thousands - same for any others who are TRS or Pro - sure, Level 2 sellers can charge that too - but, depends on what category you are in. My category, I would be looked at like a crazy person if I tried to charge that much. Do I get orders that are hundreds of dollars? Yes, I do. In fact, had 5 of them last week - but, that is not a constant in my world, so $250 would probably force me out of the site here.

They already get 20% of what I charge, fees from the buyers, fees if one promotes their Gigs and fees if one is in the seller plus group. Why the heck are you even entertaining this idea or what I feel is some are even encouraging it and giving the fee they think is "fair"! WTH?

Unless I was "grandfathered in" due to being here for years and holding up my end of the bargain I signed up for, I would probably have to leave if they decided to charge 100's a month just to "exist" here. And, you know what? Even if you pay a membership fee, whether it is $5 a month or $500, that still  does not guarantee you will get orders, will be able to avoid scammers, cancellations, lose your rank, etc.

So, no, I wouldn't "welcome" it. Why would I invite someone to charge me another fee on top of what I DO pay them? I am sure all of you who are eagerly saying it would be great because it would clean the site up also eagerly hand over thousands to the IRS (or whatever tax agency your country has) too!  😒

GG

[newsmike]

On 6/26/2021 at 5:29 AM, vibronx said:

Also, putting a flat fee as high as $250 would make it very difficult for talented people from lower-income countries to join. I don't think Fiverr would want to make it almost impossible for people from certain parts of the world to start selling.

 

Fair, but there are a couple undeniable facts to consider. 

You need to realize that Fiverr is a for profit business. So the more they reduce $5 orders and replace with $25 orders, the more profitable they are. This seems to be their general direction quite steadily for the past few years. Their name is probably the biggest hindrance to moving more quickly.  

At the end of the day, a publicly traded company is not in the business of solving global inequalities, (a worthy cause, certainly, but for charities). Businesses are in the "making money" business.  Plan and simple. If Fiverr's leadership did not do so, the shareholders would swiftly replace them with others that would. 

[yannisenglish]

46 minutes ago, newsmike said:

Fair, but there are a couple undeniable facts to consider. 

You need to realize that Fiverr is a for profit business. So the more they reduce $5 orders and replace with $25 orders, the more profitable they are. This seems to be their general direction quite steadily for the past few years. Their name is probably the biggest hindrance to moving more quickly.  

At the end of the day, a publicly traded company is not in the business of solving global inequalities, (a worthy cause, certainly, but for charities). Businesses are in the "making money" business.  Plan and simple. If Fiverr's leadership did not do so, the shareholders would swiftly replace them with others that would. 

Let's not assume what makes or doesn't make Fiverr money. Fiverr is till widely known as the place where you can get things done in a wide variety of price ranges. For better or for worse, people are still looking for cheaper alternatives and someone is always going to try to fill that void.

[francescaabb]

On 6/27/2021 at 3:16 PM, genuineguidance said:

Why the heck are you even entertaining this idea or what I feel is some are even encouraging it and giving the fee they think is "fair"! WTH?

Exactly what I was thinking. Why would someone need to pay to work? As someone who has 3 jobs to survive this makes me unbelievably mad. Asking for an entrance fee (especially that high)  means ignoring either reality or free market. 

250$ is a monthly mortgage in my country. 

 

[leannelrivers]

I've thought about a paid membership but I imagine it would be a high price. At least with commission you only pay when you earn. But if you're raking the orders in it could be very lucrative to not pay 20% on every order and every tip. I would definitely want to see some improvements on the seller side, especially with the decisions CS make about certain things and how they manage stats. On the other hand, paid membership would wipe out many people from having an opportunity to offer services here if they couldn't afford the initial fee. On the other OTHER hand, it would clean the place up a bit.

Whatever Fiverr decides, I just hope it's well communicated in advance instead of it being another thing we kind of just wake up to. 

[looseink]

I think a Seller Membership Fee has to be high enough to screen out some of the newbies who currently sign up for free to make a fast buck.

I also think there has to be a screening process that further weeds out Sellers who should not be on this platform, or maybe create a Fiverr Lite for them where BRs are the only source of income and the rest of us who pay a Membership Fee gain access to Buyers not using BRs.

There has to be a way to separate the cream from the rest of the barrel.

[newsmike]

10 hours ago, yannisenglish said:

Let's not assume what makes or doesn't make Fiverr money. 

No assumption necessary. It is crystal clear. Fiverr takes 20% of each order, and the larger the order, the bigger that 20% is.  So if you are selling at $10 and I am selling at $50, then fiver makes $2 from your sale, or $10 from mine.  Which would rather have?  Rather simple actually. 

[catwriter]

23 minutes ago, newsmike said:

So if you are selling at $10 and I am selling at $50, then fiver makes $2 from your sale, or $10 from mine.

True, but if they make 100 sales every month and you make 10, then Fiverr makes more from them than from you (plus everyone ordering from them also pays a $2 small order fee, which they don't pay when ordering from you).

[mastercreator3]

Well I accept that a fee is a really good way to screen out sellers but I have a question I am a new seller and I have started out a few months back I have not fully established myself in the platform while you are all Top rated, Level 2 and Level 1 sellers you have a flow of clients so do we have an equal footing here? No. You should also consider new talented sellers. I accept totally that you want the platform to be more professional so when you started out as a new seller did you get established immediately no right so without a guarantee of orders and clients how could a new seller invest on Fiverr platform. You have to be considerate to the feelings of new sellers too. 

[mariashtelle1]

It's easy to say that you would pay 250$ for membership on Fiverr when you are already established seller here and you know for a fact that you will make that money anyway.

I know what Fiverr brings me and I probably would stick to it anyway. But for new sellers who didn't try the platform or don't have established clientele it will be almost impossible to afford that. 

Remembering myself 8 years ago, I wouldn't have joined any paid memberships, and in fact I didn't. I have profiles on most freelancing websites but I use only a couple of them for various reasons but "paid memberships" or "pay to play" is definitely a factor for  me when I have to pay upfront without knowing what would it bring and what would be the ROI.

[chrisdata]

Who suggest $250 monthly fee is just unrealistic.

Beginning this year due to the marketplace is saturated and pandemic, and the new algorithm, I feel low motivation to work on this platform, like we begging for orders.

2021 just sucks.
 

[miiila]

3 hours ago, mastercreator3 said:

but I have a question I am a new seller and I have started out a few months back I have not fully established myself in the platform while you are all Top rated, Level 2 and Level 1 sellers you have a flow of clients so do we have an equal footing here? No. You should also consider

If you read closely, you will see that some of us do consider that, and even both for new sellers as well as established sellers. Some are against a fee at all, ask OP how much, discuss on what to base it, suggest a free trial period for new sellers, ... 

Just the same as new sellers, levelled sellers aren't a monolithic block of people with the same opinions.

Also, unless things have changed since I was new and reached those levels, I'm not under the illusion that level 1, or 2, not even TRS, automatically means that that they could/would pay an amount of $250 every month, some might not make that much monthly imcome on Fiverr that it would be worth a fee of $250, or even lower, or at least not regularly, some of them do Fiverr part-time, for instance.

And keep in mind that $250 wasn't a suggestion by the person who created this topic but by a seller who commented, so many of the replies are to the opening post, not the $250 post 🙂

[raghnalltuathai]

Hey guys,
I think you all are pretty stuck on the $250 proposal right now. However, that was just the idea of another user and was not in the original post.

I myself wouldn't consider $250 a month on Fiverr either and I really don't make bad on the platform. So that wasn't what was meant by my original idea. I was thinking more of a smaller fee like for the Seller Plus Program - say in the $20-$29 range and cancellable monthly. In exchange, you could lower the 20% commission percentage a bit, for example. And maybe the gig promotion feature would no longer be necessary.

Fiverr is actually one of the few platforms where membership is free - but you can see that because of the many copy cats, scammers and fakers that this plays into the hands of. And the 1000 forum threads on "how to make a first sell?!".

The danger due to the pandemic and the increasing number of "sellers" who have heard from some YouTube Guru that you can make money quickly by using photoshop templates, is that many really good sellers will go under (i noticed the rising amount of forum posts from people who once worked full-time on Fiverr and now get no more impressions, clicks and orders). Fiverr says you should also market yourself, but instead of then putting the money into Google Ads advertising, I would rather pay a small fee, which then ensures that the marketplace is cleaned of all the false offers and real services are found more often and more easily again. As I said - I'm checking the first page when looking for my own gig and 90% per site is scam and stolen portfolio. I have to compete with clips from Pixar Movies and potential customers with no technical background no longer have an overview of which service is realistic and fair for which price.

To throw another analogy into the room:
Fiverr is currently a fitness center where you can train for free. Sounds awesome first. But over time all those who actually want to train regularly would no longer get a place on the machines because they are all the time occupied by people who only come to train for 1-2 days before giving up and actually have no serious interest and knowledge of the workout.

[leannelrivers]

5 hours ago, mastercreator3 said:

Well I accept that a fee is a really good way to screen out sellers but I have a question I am a new seller and I have started out a few months back I have not fully established myself in the platform while you are all Top rated, Level 2 and Level 1 sellers you have a flow of clients so do we have an equal footing here? No. You should also consider new talented sellers. I accept totally that you want the platform to be more professional so when you started out as a new seller did you get established immediately no right so without a guarantee of orders and clients how could a new seller invest on Fiverr platform. You have to be considerate to the feelings of new sellers too. 

I would hope that most of us do consider the feelings and the impact a high fee would have on new sellers. We were all there and we didn't suddenly become cold-hearted and uncaring once we got our levels. Having said that, a monthly fee would really help to solve the problem of scam sellers and sellers looking to make a fast buck without having developed the necessary skills to provide a decent service or even write a decent gig description. There are many such sellers on Fiverr and it drags the platform down and saturates the place so much that talented sellers, new or not, tend to get lost in the ocean of gigs. Fiverr is investing a lot in the growth of the platform and I would assume the overall reputation is important. 

The random $250 figure was just thrown out there and I would consider that too high. I'm with raghnalltuathai, the idea of a lower membership fee is more palatable and it would be manageable for most people who are serious about their freelance career. Most of the successful freelancers I know have invested hundreds, if not thousands, into themselves over the years and it does reap rewards. 

looseink mentioned "Fiverr Lite". Why not? Or a tiered payment system. It may come across as hierarchical and brutal but some kind of quality control would be great. There are a number of other platforms that have a paid membership AND vet freelancers before accepting them regardless of whether they pay or not. 

[raghnalltuathai]

43 minutes ago, leannelrivers said:

I'm with raghnalltuathai, the idea of a lower membership fee is more palatable and it would be manageable for most people who are serious about their freelance career. Most of the successful freelancers I know have invested hundreds, if not thousands, into themselves over the years and it does reap rewards. 

That's actually a very good point and called ROI - Return On Investment. And if a monthly fee will help to get more spotlight onto serious sellers and gigs and increase your sales, it is worth it in my opinion. Of course there is no 100% guarantee for that, that's why I think something like a free month for new sellers and a monthly plan that can be cancelled at any time could be a fair agreement.

I have multiple businesses on other platforms as well (like courses, digital products, etc.). They all require a monthly fee or get a share of each sale. Even if you switch and set up your own business on your own website you'll have to pay for monthly server costs, maybe a wordpress theme or plugin, advertisment and more.

Edited June 30, 2021 by raghnalltuathai

[leannelrivers]

16 minutes ago, raghnalltuathai said:

a free month for new sellers and a monthly plan that can be cancelled at any time could be a fair agreement.

Agreed. Give everyone a chance to find their feet with it for a month or two. And you're right, most things come with a fee and why shouldn't they? I expect payment for what I provide and my clients don't sulk when they have to pay me. 

Edited June 30, 2021 by leannelrivers
Spelling mistake

[yannisenglish]

On 6/29/2021 at 6:34 AM, newsmike said:

No assumption necessary. It is crystal clear. Fiverr takes 20% of each order, and the larger the order, the bigger that 20% is.  So if you are selling at $10 and I am selling at $50, then fiver makes $2 from your sale, or $10 from mine.  Which would rather have?  Rather simple actually. 

Depends if the number of big orders far outweighs the smaller ones. It's proportionate and we don't know that data.

[newsmike]

9 hours ago, raghnalltuathai said:

Fiverr is actually one of the few platforms where membership is free - but you can see that because of the many copy cats, scammers and fakers that this plays into the hands of. And the 1000 forum threads on "how to make a first sell?!".

Yep.  This all boils down to whether fiverr is a place where people can open a business, or is it a free money distribution system for 6 billion people? In almost any situation, whether you are opening a doctors office, a book store or a kebob shop, you have some expenses to make when you open a business. Rent, electricity, taxes, inventory, payroll. etc...  You don't get a free coffee shop handed to you, do you?  And if you did, every other store front would be a coffee shop with an owner who invested nothing, and therefore has nothing to lose. How many times have we seen bad sellers get banned, and popup with a new account the next day?

I realize that we live in an age where "it's not fair" can pass a a reasoned argument.  But honestly, this is business. Now if someone wanted to start a charity site that offers opportunities as you are describing, I say, Bravo! 

But, I ask most seriously, are we running businesses here?  Or is fiverr an equity project?  It has to be one or the other. You can be both and be publicly traded on the NASDAQ.

 

[moikchap]

To me, fiverr is democratized offshoring. I don't have the money for North American/Western Europe prices, I'm barely earning above minimum wage at my day job. I'm spending savings, not revenue, to pay the sellers here to help me with my first project. Whether or not I get to try and make a business is basically dictated by my level of access to people with lower living expenses relative to mine where my savings are actually an enticing amount. Membership fees would reduce the number of those people, ones whom are likely similarly trying to start their seller gigs off savings rather than revenue judging by how many 0-queue/0-rating sellers I've used and gone back to with more work and ratings.

[newsmike]

On 6/25/2021 at 3:58 AM, raghnalltuathai said:

I'd say a rough estimate is that 80% (or more) are scammers/faker. I struggle to rank well on pages 1-3 due to the mass of these fake gigs.

We are really having 2 different conversations here. Above is what the OP stated as the problem. So the discussion was about how to eliminate the large amounts of low quality, scammer accounts. I do agree that something has to be done. Again, a business owner with nothing to lose and no reason to care, is not a recipe for quaity. The low quality, scammer sellers are what gives fiverr its image problem. 

For example in my category of voice over, it is a very common request that I send the agencies buying my services a demo to play for their client. Very often they ask that the demo has no fiverr branding on it whatsoever. They like what they can buy from me, but clearly do not want their client to know that they are buying from a fiverr seller. That is a real problem, and if fiverr is going to continue to raise the bar on quaity, and image (especially since Microsoft is launching a competitor at fiverr this fall), they need to purge the sellers that create the image of low quality.

This topic went sideways when the issue switched to the fact that not every person on the planet could afford to pay to partcipate. I completely get your point, but "not everyone can afford it", is not the answer to what the OP brought up. Nor can it be a a reason not to drive quality and image upwards. 

I cannot afford the $500,000 franchise fee to open a McDonald's restaurant. Is that unfair? No. Should I get one for free because of that, No. The franchise fee is there to make sure that anyone who opens a McD's has their mortage on the line to make it a success, and will lose their shirt if it fails. That's how you keep people engaged, and focused on quality and performance. 

That's just business. And trying to redefine fiverr as "democratized offshoring" is inconsistent with the reality that is in fact a publicly traded company on the NASDAQ, which has a fidicuary responsibility to maximize revenue for its shareholders, first, last and foremost. That's it.

 

  

[moikchap]

I agree they have a need to maximize revenue, the point I'm hoping to convey is that adding a fee would not necessarily be a pure revenue win. Democratizing offshoring is consistent with the goal of fiduciary responsibility in that it monetizes a larger consumer base by increasing supply, which lowers prices to allow capturing clients from those who have a lower price tolerance, increasing total revenue rather than simply increasing the average revenue per user.

[leannelrivers]

1 hour ago, newsmike said:

Very often they ask that the demo has no fiverr branding on it whatsoever. They like what they can buy from me, but clearly do not want their client to know that they are buying from a fiverr seller.

I get this very often too. "Can you please send me your demo without the Fiverr reference?" Fiverr still has a shady, cheap reputation with many people. Just the name alone sends some people running for the hills. (I love your voice by the way.) 

 

5 hours ago, moikchap said:

Whether or not I get to try and make a business is basically dictated by my level of access to people with lower living expenses relative to mine where my savings are actually an enticing amount.

You would still have access to those people. I can't imagine Fiverr adding a membership fee for buyers too and IF a membership system was introduced, I'd be surprised if Fiverr set it so high as to wipe out anyone who might not be able to afford it. 

Having a system that would help deter scammers and low quality sellers would, hopefully, help the talented new sellers get their foot in the door because at the moment there are some great freelancers who are lost in the sheer number of gigs similar to theirs. And people are forced to price themselves as low as possible just in order to compete with all the other $5 gigs. Video editing for $5 ,for example. It's a joke. 

I've often helped out new business owners and students with their projects for a very low price because sometimes it's just good to help. So I don't think buyers on a low budget would suffer too much. But if sellers felt safe enough to raise their prices, even to $10, then buyers who expect the world on a plate for nothing would maybe need to work a little harder on building good relationships because they would be dealing with sellers who are a little more serious and invested in themselves. And I'm not referring to you in any way when I mention these kinds of buyers.

More revenue is obviously Fiverr's goal. It's my goal too. It's every sellers's goal. But Fiverr also do a lot to push their image as a quality marketplace that gives talented freelancers a stage to succeed and that imagine doesn't align with the amount of dodginess on the platform. I feel I'm starting to go off the rails here. Great thread though! 

[moikchap]

It didn't really get discussed, because it was at the bottom of my post in the middle of the $250 debate, but I proposed a potential system for weeding out scammers without needing a fee. I'm already using the system myself because fiverr's suggestions are always upsells.

I knew coming in, because of the site's reputation, that there would be a lot of waste on inadequate sellers. I budgeted an assumption that a third of the stuff I received would need to be tossed. It took me giving work to about 50 sellers to get about 100 pieces of art I can use after about 140 deliveries. About 25 sellers were just bad, 15 increased their prices within a few orders, and I have about 10 left that are likely reliable for the remaining 80 pieces I need at prices I can afford. I have similar results among the people who delivered D&D rulebook style writing.

I have the data Fiverr would need to make a meaningful cut to the bottom end of a few niche category's quality without meaningfully affecting prices. It would be better for everyone, meeting all these goals, if they knew what I knew. But, the only thing they ask is if I'm satisfied or not and if I'll use the delivery or not. I paid for about 40 deliveries where I then turned around and said I'm not going to use them, after paying for them. That should make Fiverr suspicious of something. Does anything happen though? Who knows.

I feel the system should be something along those lines, where when you have a buyer who is casting a wide net, do something like reduce fiver's fees so they can cast it wider, and give them a more detailed feedback options, and then put that type of stuff over to the Trust & Safety committee for review. 

Edited July 1, 2021 by moikchap
clarifying orders/deliveries, whose fees