Welcome to "Fiverr 3.0"!

[english_voice]

Hey everyone!

frank hello600×600 2.06 MB

A disclaimer: The following post/article is not an official Fiverr statement. It’s a summary of my personal observations over how Fiverr works and I am sharing because I noticed that more and more sellers come here, stating that they “lost their ranking”.

This is my effort to provide them with some answers and some food for thought.

Hold up. Fiverr 3.0?

If Fiverr’s early days (the wild wild west days) was Fiverr 1.0 and we count the facelift in 2014 (I think?) as v2.0, then we quietly got v3.0 late last year.

Without an official announcement, without much fanfare, the website slowly rolled out a back end update which seems to have concluded late last year.

How do I know this?

This is a good time to remind you to read my disclaimer.

I have no way of actually knowing anything, no one from Fiverr shared insights with me either. This is just a gut feeling and tons of personal observation, from a seller obsessed with performance. (and figuring out how things work)

Ranking is no more

I started hinting about this mid-2020, then started actively talking about it.

Talking about ranking is moot, as there are no more results pages. Well technically there are, but you’ll see what I mean in a minute.

Fiverr transitioned from being a search engine like Google to being a match making service like Tinder.

It no longer serves users (buyers) with pages filled with search results, ranked according to how well they are “performing”.

Fiverr also no longer counts on buyers clicking on verticals to find what they need.

It’s all about the search function.

Fiverr’s new engine tries to match a buyer with a potential seller that will be as close to a 100% ideal match as possible, as soon as possible.

A great match is when:

A) a seller offers something relative to what the buyer is searching for

and

B) a seller has great “performance”

It’s all about reducing risk for Fiverr.

Risk that the buyer won’t find someone to hire and therefore won’t spent their money.

Or risk that the buyer will not get a great service and ask for a refund, never to return again on the platform.

What is this “performance” you keep going on about?

Here comes the good stuff.

There are two kinds of performance that Fiverr keeps track of:

A) performance as a seller (converting prospects into buyers)

B) performance as a vendor (satisfying buyers, successfully completing orders)

THAT’S IT.

Fiverr doesn’t care if you are the best designer, video editor, animator, writer, what have you.

All it cares is that you can make people spend and then making sure that said people don’t ask their money back. (And therefore stay on the platform to spend some more)

I am oversimplifying things, as the system actually keeps track of a bunch of interesting metrics when serving buyers with sellers.

Which is why searching for your gig, or your competition on Fiverr, even using incognito or clearing cookies and what not, will NEVER show you anything useful.

The new engine qualifies buyers and knows a lot about them, before serving your gig their way:

-their purchase intent

-buying history

-browsing habits (I mean on site)

-how they respond to custom offers

-when they spend

-how they spend

The list is long, and I am sure that even if I am right on some of the stuff I think I understand, there are hundreds more variables that only Fiverr’s coders know.

OK, let’s say you are right. What now?

Well just like every change in life, it is always met with resistance.

The new “engine” is here to stay apparently, since its sole purpose is making the platform more money.

What should we do?

Why are people losing their “rankings” out of the blue?

This is where I will try to sound less like a lunatic and actually try to form all the observations into some -hopefully- actionable advice.

When people start noticing that their gigs are losing impressions, or that messages stop coming in, etc, it’s usually because their performance has deteriorated.

They dropped the ball somehow.

I know it always seems like it’s out of the blue, but there are indicators.

Here are some things to keep in mind.

The new system values speed and relevance over anything else.

It’s all RELEVANT: (performance A)

So performance A (being a good closer) has everything to do with how your gig is set up.

If you still think about SEO, and keywords, and ranking, you already lost the game.

Focus on your gig’s title, don’t try to capture everyone, don’t use pretty adjectives, focus on who you want to find your gig.

You need to be focused on your niche.

Relevance is key. You need to make sure that only the people you can help will find you, and that will make Fiverr LOVE your gig.

Don’t use the same keywords as what you used as a gig title. Trust me.

Fiverr 3.0 hates that.

Your tags need to be complimentary to your title. Not repeating what you say you will do.

Again: relevance.

If your gig’s description is written with “SEO” in mind, and is “keyword-rich”, you will once again underperform. Fiverr 3.0 no longer crawls for keywords, it rewards descriptions that answer questions and help convert.

The need for SPEED: (performance B)

Fiverr 3.0 loves speed.

The quicker you can respond to inquiries the better.

The sooner you get that custom offer accepted, the better.

Other factors that may show Fiverr you are rocking it:

-Delivering fast

-Buyers accepting their delivery relatively quickly

-Not getting lots of revision requests

-Not leaving order updates unanswered for too long (the “buyer has posted an update for X amount of hours” notification)

-Delivering before the “you have 12 hours to deliver” notification

-Avoiding cancellations

-Avoiding time extensions

Oh, one more thing:

Relevance and speed are just two faces of a multi-faced die, that calculates one very important thing.

Fiverr 3.0 is all about having satisfied buyers.

The platform no longer just focuses on making revenue and having gigs purchased.

The updated engine focuses solely on having happy buyers.

Which leads me to my last point for this article, to whoever wants to hear it:

Your reviews no longer matter as much. You can keep getting all 5-star reviews, and you will still experience lulls and droughts.

Because the system no longer takes public reviews into consideration, using the same weight as Fiverr 2.0.

They still count, but not as much.

And can you blame them? The majority of sellers on the platform can be phoning it in and still get a higher than 4.7 average.

The system has too many 5-star sellers for that metric to indicate anything.

If everyone is 5-stars, then no one is 5-stars. (to paraphrase something I keep saying for TRS badges.)

So unfortunately, and maybe even people gaming the system with fake reviews had something to do with this, public reviews no longer mean as much to the platform, when it calculates how happy our buyers are.

It’s a long and complex formula, but I simplified it to this for now:

Performance A + Performance B + Buyer satisfaction = Actual seller rating

I still think that “gig rotation” is not a thing. It does exist, but it would never tank successful sellers and truly valuable gigs.

So to sum up:

-When you search for your gig and find it, that’s a skewed POV, that’s not telling you the whole story. You should stop doing that.

-When your gig is served to buyers, it’s because Fiverr actually believes you can score.

-The gigs that are also presented along your offering, are also very carefully selected based on their performance. There is no “ranking”.

-When you notice a drop in sales/enquiries/impressions, start thinking about your overall performance. More often than not, there is definitely some indicator that “told” Fiverr that you were dropping the proverbial ball.

The bad news is that this will take some getting used to and sellers are once again asked to either adapt or “perish”.

The good news is that this new system is actually a lot more forgiving than the old “SEO/rank” system. Even if you drop the ball performance wise, all it takes is just a tiny spark to get things going again.

As I write this, and gave it a quick read I understand that I may have oversimplified things, or that I haven’t spelled it out as much as I could.

Please forgive me, as I have a birthday cake to attend to. 🙂

As always I will be here to answer any questions and discuss things in detail with you all.

Thank you!

main_3800×800 433 KB

-Delivering before the “you have 12 hours to deliver” notification

I had never stopped to think that this could be a metric - and a negative one at that.

I can’t recall when I last delivered an order late, but it will be several years ago.

However, I have had plenty of these ‘12 hours’ reminders - because I diary in my work and tell clients when they can expect their finished job. I’ll often receive the ‘12 hours’ notification overnight knowing that that client’s job is pencilled in for first thing in the morning.

All this time should I have been treating these ‘reminders’ as warnings, and therefore ensuring that I don’t deliver orders in the final 12 hours?

PS. Very informative post. Thank you.

[navya_r]

Hey everyone!

frank hello600×600 2.06 MB

A disclaimer: The following post/article is not an official Fiverr statement. It’s a summary of my personal observations over how Fiverr works and I am sharing because I noticed that more and more sellers come here, stating that they “lost their ranking”.

This is my effort to provide them with some answers and some food for thought.

Hold up. Fiverr 3.0?

If Fiverr’s early days (the wild wild west days) was Fiverr 1.0 and we count the facelift in 2014 (I think?) as v2.0, then we quietly got v3.0 late last year.

Without an official announcement, without much fanfare, the website slowly rolled out a back end update which seems to have concluded late last year.

How do I know this?

This is a good time to remind you to read my disclaimer.

I have no way of actually knowing anything, no one from Fiverr shared insights with me either. This is just a gut feeling and tons of personal observation, from a seller obsessed with performance. (and figuring out how things work)

Ranking is no more

I started hinting about this mid-2020, then started actively talking about it.

Talking about ranking is moot, as there are no more results pages. Well technically there are, but you’ll see what I mean in a minute.

Fiverr transitioned from being a search engine like Google to being a match making service like Tinder.

It no longer serves users (buyers) with pages filled with search results, ranked according to how well they are “performing”.

Fiverr also no longer counts on buyers clicking on verticals to find what they need.

It’s all about the search function.

Fiverr’s new engine tries to match a buyer with a potential seller that will be as close to a 100% ideal match as possible, as soon as possible.

A great match is when:

A) a seller offers something relative to what the buyer is searching for

and

B) a seller has great “performance”

It’s all about reducing risk for Fiverr.

Risk that the buyer won’t find someone to hire and therefore won’t spent their money.

Or risk that the buyer will not get a great service and ask for a refund, never to return again on the platform.

What is this “performance” you keep going on about?

Here comes the good stuff.

There are two kinds of performance that Fiverr keeps track of:

A) performance as a seller (converting prospects into buyers)

B) performance as a vendor (satisfying buyers, successfully completing orders)

THAT’S IT.

Fiverr doesn’t care if you are the best designer, video editor, animator, writer, what have you.

All it cares is that you can make people spend and then making sure that said people don’t ask their money back. (And therefore stay on the platform to spend some more)

I am oversimplifying things, as the system actually keeps track of a bunch of interesting metrics when serving buyers with sellers.

Which is why searching for your gig, or your competition on Fiverr, even using incognito or clearing cookies and what not, will NEVER show you anything useful.

The new engine qualifies buyers and knows a lot about them, before serving your gig their way:

-their purchase intent

-buying history

-browsing habits (I mean on site)

-how they respond to custom offers

-when they spend

-how they spend

The list is long, and I am sure that even if I am right on some of the stuff I think I understand, there are hundreds more variables that only Fiverr’s coders know.

OK, let’s say you are right. What now?

Well just like every change in life, it is always met with resistance.

The new “engine” is here to stay apparently, since its sole purpose is making the platform more money.

What should we do?

Why are people losing their “rankings” out of the blue?

This is where I will try to sound less like a lunatic and actually try to form all the observations into some -hopefully- actionable advice.

When people start noticing that their gigs are losing impressions, or that messages stop coming in, etc, it’s usually because their performance has deteriorated.

They dropped the ball somehow.

I know it always seems like it’s out of the blue, but there are indicators.

Here are some things to keep in mind.

The new system values speed and relevance over anything else.

It’s all RELEVANT: (performance A)

So performance A (being a good closer) has everything to do with how your gig is set up.

If you still think about SEO, and keywords, and ranking, you already lost the game.

Focus on your gig’s title, don’t try to capture everyone, don’t use pretty adjectives, focus on who you want to find your gig.

You need to be focused on your niche.

Relevance is key. You need to make sure that only the people you can help will find you, and that will make Fiverr LOVE your gig.

Don’t use the same keywords as what you used as a gig title. Trust me.

Fiverr 3.0 hates that.

Your tags need to be complimentary to your title. Not repeating what you say you will do.

Again: relevance.

If your gig’s description is written with “SEO” in mind, and is “keyword-rich”, you will once again underperform. Fiverr 3.0 no longer crawls for keywords, it rewards descriptions that answer questions and help convert.

The need for SPEED: (performance B)

Fiverr 3.0 loves speed.

The quicker you can respond to inquiries the better.

The sooner you get that custom offer accepted, the better.

Other factors that may show Fiverr you are rocking it:

-Delivering fast

-Buyers accepting their delivery relatively quickly

-Not getting lots of revision requests

-Not leaving order updates unanswered for too long (the “buyer has posted an update for X amount of hours” notification)

-Delivering before the “you have 12 hours to deliver” notification

-Avoiding cancellations

-Avoiding time extensions

Oh, one more thing:

Relevance and speed are just two faces of a multi-faced die, that calculates one very important thing.

Fiverr 3.0 is all about having satisfied buyers.

The platform no longer just focuses on making revenue and having gigs purchased.

The updated engine focuses solely on having happy buyers.

Which leads me to my last point for this article, to whoever wants to hear it:

Your reviews no longer matter as much. You can keep getting all 5-star reviews, and you will still experience lulls and droughts.

Because the system no longer takes public reviews into consideration, using the same weight as Fiverr 2.0.

They still count, but not as much.

And can you blame them? The majority of sellers on the platform can be phoning it in and still get a higher than 4.7 average.

The system has too many 5-star sellers for that metric to indicate anything.

If everyone is 5-stars, then no one is 5-stars. (to paraphrase something I keep saying for TRS badges.)

So unfortunately, and maybe even people gaming the system with fake reviews had something to do with this, public reviews no longer mean as much to the platform, when it calculates how happy our buyers are.

It’s a long and complex formula, but I simplified it to this for now:

Performance A + Performance B + Buyer satisfaction = Actual seller rating

I still think that “gig rotation” is not a thing. It does exist, but it would never tank successful sellers and truly valuable gigs.

So to sum up:

-When you search for your gig and find it, that’s a skewed POV, that’s not telling you the whole story. You should stop doing that.

-When your gig is served to buyers, it’s because Fiverr actually believes you can score.

-The gigs that are also presented along your offering, are also very carefully selected based on their performance. There is no “ranking”.

-When you notice a drop in sales/enquiries/impressions, start thinking about your overall performance. More often than not, there is definitely some indicator that “told” Fiverr that you were dropping the proverbial ball.

The bad news is that this will take some getting used to and sellers are once again asked to either adapt or “perish”.

The good news is that this new system is actually a lot more forgiving than the old “SEO/rank” system. Even if you drop the ball performance wise, all it takes is just a tiny spark to get things going again.

As I write this, and gave it a quick read I understand that I may have oversimplified things, or that I haven’t spelled it out as much as I could.

Please forgive me, as I have a birthday cake to attend to. 🙂

As always I will be here to answer any questions and discuss things in detail with you all.

Thank you!

main_3800×800 433 KB

This has been an informative read, especially for a relatively new seller like me. Thank you!

Performance A + Performance B + Buyer satisfaction = Actual seller rating

If 5-star reviews matter less now, how is Fiverr judging buyer satisfaction? Do you believe that the private reviews provided by the buyers to Fiverr on seller service will matter more now? I’m assuming they already mattered quite a lot in determining things like ‘Fiverr’s Choice’ badges or gig ranking though.

Not getting lots of revision requests

How many is “lots”? Over three? Or even one revision request could penalise us?

Also, what about repeat buyers? Does they also positively impact the algorithm since it indicates happy/satisfied customers?

[frank_d]

-Delivering before the “you have 12 hours to deliver” notification

I had never stopped to think that this could be a metric - and a negative one at that.

I can’t recall when I last delivered an order late, but it will be several years ago.

However, I have had plenty of these ‘12 hours’ reminders - because I diary in my work and tell clients when they can expect their finished job. I’ll often receive the ‘12 hours’ notification overnight knowing that that client’s job is pencilled in for first thing in the morning.

All this time should I have been treating these ‘reminders’ as warnings, and therefore ensuring that I don’t deliver orders in the final 12 hours?

PS. Very informative post. Thank you.

All this time should I have been treating these ‘reminders’ as warnings, and therefore ensuring that I don’t deliver orders in the final 12 hours?

Hey @english_voice !

Well this is just me making this assumption.

I could be wrong, but hear me out:

If Fiverr wants to track efficiency, and one of the platform’s main pain points is sellers missing deadlines, then this automated notification could be used as a metric.

It tells the system the percentage of orders you complete by “cutting it close”.

The machine isn’t that bright, so it can’t really tell if that’s OK or if your buyer didn’t get back to you on time on X, etc.

But it can see that out of 20 orders, 12 of them were down to the wire.

So this may tell the system that you are not that efficient, or that you are too busy at the moment.

Or that maybe your gig is not optimized as you should add a day to your delivery window.

Feel free to take this with a grain if salt.

Right now I am not getting as many messages or orders as before because I had 3 Pro orders, each one taking 15 days to complete plus some of my regular gig orders were delivered within that “last 12 hours” window.

So my belief is that it does count, not sure what the exact weight of this metric is. It’s definitely not as weighted as you missing the delivery of course.

[frank_d]

This has been an informative read, especially for a relatively new seller like me. Thank you!

Performance A + Performance B + Buyer satisfaction = Actual seller rating

If 5-star reviews matter less now, how is Fiverr judging buyer satisfaction? Do you believe that the private reviews provided by the buyers to Fiverr on seller service will matter more now? I’m assuming they already mattered quite a lot in determining things like ‘Fiverr’s Choice’ badges or gig ranking though.

Not getting lots of revision requests

How many is “lots”? Over three? Or even one revision request could penalise us?

Also, what about repeat buyers? Does they also positively impact the algorithm since it indicates happy/satisfied customers?

If 5-star reviews matter less now, how is Fiverr judging buyer satisfaction? Do you believe that the private reviews provided by the buyers to Fiverr on seller service will matter more now? I’m assuming they already mattered quite a lot in determining things like ‘Fiverr’s Choice’ badges or gig ranking though.

Buyer satisfaction is calculated by a unique formula and private reviews are probably the most weighted metric of that formula.

That was always the case ever since private reviews were introduced years ago.

Re: lots of reviews

You are not penalized. Revisions happen.

But when they do happen I am fairly certain that the system takes into account how often they occur across your orders and how many per order to determine how “good” your deliveries are.

So it’s an efficiency metric.

But they are not punishing sellers, if you have 3 orders and they are all under revision for example, the system will consider you busy and they may choose to serve the next best thing to buyers looking for your gig.

Re: repeat buyers

Sure that may also be taken into account but seems like something that may have less weight.

[genuineguidance]

So, get this - I get the message that I have only 12 hours to deliver and there is 15 hours left on the order.

OOOOPS!

I have to say I regularly if not always deliver when there is 12 hours or less showing - I have orders not only here but on my own site to tend to and I work on things as they were ordered. I sort of think some of the observations make us more like worker bees rather than people running our own show here.

But, I get it, they want sellers who are probably totally devoted to Fiverr as if we were married or something.

I just think they may want to fix their “bug” of telling me I have less than 12 hours when clearly, I have 15.

I still get plenty of orders here regardless though of whether I deliver an hour before it is due or a day before. My personality does not do well being “tied down” and having someone tapping their foot “reminding” me of deadlines. I am an adult, I know when things are due.

GG

[frank_d]

So, get this - I get the message that I have only 12 hours to deliver and there is 15 hours left on the order.

OOOOPS!

I have to say I regularly if not always deliver when there is 12 hours or less showing - I have orders not only here but on my own site to tend to and I work on things as they were ordered. I sort of think some of the observations make us more like worker bees rather than people running our own show here.

But, I get it, they want sellers who are probably totally devoted to Fiverr as if we were married or something.

I just think they may want to fix their “bug” of telling me I have less than 12 hours when clearly, I have 15.

I still get plenty of orders here regardless though of whether I deliver an hour before it is due or a day before. My personality does not do well being “tied down” and having someone tapping their foot “reminding” me of deadlines. I am an adult, I know when things are due.

GG

I completely agree.

It’s up to everyone to handle their business as they see fit.

I am not saying that we should follow these to the letter or that we should somehow be “worker bees” or cogs to the machine.

I am merely suggesting that these things more likely exist and it’s better to understand what is happening behind the scenes so that we can understand why there are lulls sometimes.

Just for clarity: I don’t thing delivering during the “12 hours left” window is catastrophic.

It does get counted towards performance though, so maybe the percentage of orders this happens to is important.

[muchoart]

if someone did those things practically and success?

[frank_d]

if someone did those things practically and success?

Not sure I understand the question.

Can you clarify?

[donnovan86]

I completely agree.

It’s up to everyone to handle their business as they see fit.

I am not saying that we should follow these to the letter or that we should somehow be “worker bees” or cogs to the machine.

I am merely suggesting that these things more likely exist and it’s better to understand what is happening behind the scenes so that we can understand why there are lulls sometimes.

Just for clarity: I don’t thing delivering during the “12 hours left” window is catastrophic.

It does get counted towards performance though, so maybe the percentage of orders this happens to is important.

Just for clarity: I don’t thing delivering during the “12 hours left” window is catastrophic.

It does get counted towards performance though, so maybe the percentage of orders this happens to is important.

Great post Frank, insightful and helpful for a lot of people.

Regarding what I quoted… due to the nature of my work and the fact that unlike most writers here I actually don’t outsource, I deliver only within the “12 hours left” window. I don’t have any trouble ranking because of that. I noticed reviews, cancellations and late orders have a huge impact. At least in my case.

[english_voice]

All this time should I have been treating these ‘reminders’ as warnings, and therefore ensuring that I don’t deliver orders in the final 12 hours?

Hey @english_voice !

Well this is just me making this assumption.

I could be wrong, but hear me out:

If Fiverr wants to track efficiency, and one of the platform’s main pain points is sellers missing deadlines, then this automated notification could be used as a metric.

It tells the system the percentage of orders you complete by “cutting it close”.

The machine isn’t that bright, so it can’t really tell if that’s OK or if your buyer didn’t get back to you on time on X, etc.

But it can see that out of 20 orders, 12 of them were down to the wire.

So this may tell the system that you are not that efficient, or that you are too busy at the moment.

Or that maybe your gig is not optimized as you should add a day to your delivery window.

Feel free to take this with a grain if salt.

Right now I am not getting as many messages or orders as before because I had 3 Pro orders, each one taking 15 days to complete plus some of my regular gig orders were delivered within that “last 12 hours” window.

So my belief is that it does count, not sure what the exact weight of this metric is. It’s definitely not as weighted as you missing the delivery of course.

Thanks for taking the time to explain your thinking - it makes sense.

Based on your theory, there are two types of on time delivery - one that won’t affect seller accounts, and another that will adversely affect seller accounts.

I’m now going to rethink how I handle deadlines. As I mentioned, I haven’t had a late delivery in four or five years - because I thought I was being efficient with pencilling in work and clearly communicating to buyers when they can expect their delivery.

However, it would appear my ‘efficiency’ might have been harming my account - despite delivering on time for 1,000+ days over several hundred orders.

The term ‘down to the wire’ is an interesting one. Let’s take a 24 hour service for example. Although I don’t advertise a 24 hour service, I do sometimes offer my trusted clients such a service for quick jobs. In this case is delivering after 12 hours and one second making the delivery ‘down to the wire’? I would say not. It’s basically half way through the buyer / seller agreed delivery time.

Also, in my opinion, successful and efficient freelance sellers ‘diary in’ work for completion. I’ve always thought ‘buyer beware’ if a seller is available for work immediately! Successful sellers tend to have one or two jobs on the go already. A good seller will communicate this to their buyer. Something like: “Thanks for your order. I am working on completing a job for a client this afternoon. I will be able to start work on your order in the morning and deliver by mid afternoon” - for example.

If your theory is correct (and it makes sense), then it’s unjust that Fiverr punishes sellers for simply delivering on time (albeit within the final 12 hours). If the ‘12 hours’ message is not just a friendly reminder but in fact a warning (and one that will adversely affect seller accounts), then Fiverr needs to be upfront and communicate this. For all the above reasons - on time delivery and clear communication - I consider myself to be a good seller.

But if Fiverr is artificially limiting my account and ability to attract new orders by taking into account the ‘12 hours’ message - then I need to know about it. I’ll adjust my business accordingly. This is one of those really frustrating (and harmful) aspects of Fiverr.

And yes, I note that yours is a theory. But it’s a very rational and well argued theory!

[muchoart]

The ideas you shared in this thread did u try in your gig? and get orders ?

[genuineguidance]

I completely agree.

It’s up to everyone to handle their business as they see fit.

I am not saying that we should follow these to the letter or that we should somehow be “worker bees” or cogs to the machine.

I am merely suggesting that these things more likely exist and it’s better to understand what is happening behind the scenes so that we can understand why there are lulls sometimes.

Just for clarity: I don’t thing delivering during the “12 hours left” window is catastrophic.

It does get counted towards performance though, so maybe the percentage of orders this happens to is important.

It does get counted towards performance though, so maybe the percentage of orders this happens to is important.

I will keep that in mind. It just rubs me the wrong way as if you have someone over your shoulder looking at you and tapping their foot. I also do not deliver days or long before the delivery date because, there is an EXTRA for that - you want your stuff in 24 hours? Then you have to pay a fee to cut in front of the line. I always felt like if I deliver in under 24 hours (if I am not doing anything better with my time) it gives the impression that the next time they order, they will get the same fast delivery. I don’t want to train people to think that is how it would be. So, I usually do it within that “you have 12 hours left” window, so that they A: get it on time and B: usually hours before it is due.

They need to fix the bug that told me a 15 hour remaining on the order Gig clock is 12 hours and under now. I just delivered it, so it was over the 12 hour mark. Oh well, can’t win for losing it seems!

GG

[eoinfinnegan]

Thanks for taking the time to explain your thinking - it makes sense.

Based on your theory, there are two types of on time delivery - one that won’t affect seller accounts, and another that will adversely affect seller accounts.

I’m now going to rethink how I handle deadlines. As I mentioned, I haven’t had a late delivery in four or five years - because I thought I was being efficient with pencilling in work and clearly communicating to buyers when they can expect their delivery.

However, it would appear my ‘efficiency’ might have been harming my account - despite delivering on time for 1,000+ days over several hundred orders.

The term ‘down to the wire’ is an interesting one. Let’s take a 24 hour service for example. Although I don’t advertise a 24 hour service, I do sometimes offer my trusted clients such a service for quick jobs. In this case is delivering after 12 hours and one second making the delivery ‘down to the wire’? I would say not. It’s basically half way through the buyer / seller agreed delivery time.

Also, in my opinion, successful and efficient freelance sellers ‘diary in’ work for completion. I’ve always thought ‘buyer beware’ if a seller is available for work immediately! Successful sellers tend to have one or two jobs on the go already. A good seller will communicate this to their buyer. Something like: “Thanks for your order. I am working on completing a job for a client this afternoon. I will be able to start work on your order in the morning and deliver by mid afternoon” - for example.

If your theory is correct (and it makes sense), then it’s unjust that Fiverr punishes sellers for simply delivering on time (albeit within the final 12 hours). If the ‘12 hours’ message is not just a friendly reminder but in fact a warning (and one that will adversely affect seller accounts), then Fiverr needs to be upfront and communicate this. For all the above reasons - on time delivery and clear communication - I consider myself to be a good seller.

But if Fiverr is artificially limiting my account and ability to attract new orders by taking into account the ‘12 hours’ message - then I need to know about it. I’ll adjust my business accordingly. This is one of those really frustrating (and harmful) aspects of Fiverr.

And yes, I note that yours is a theory. But it’s a very rational and well argued theory!

I’m now going to rethink how I handle deadlines. As I mentioned, I haven’t had a late delivery in four or five years - because I thought I was being efficient with pencilling in work and clearly communicating to buyers when they can expect their delivery.

This whole subject of delivering early is one I had been thinking about before my break. I was sure I had seen clear boosts in impressions and clicks after a productive day where I cleared a couple of orders which had a day or two left on them.

Could have been coincidence but thinking further on it based on what Frank has said, it makes perfect sense for this to be a metric.

I have a vague recollection of a Buyer survey Fiverr did at some point where delivering early was one of the most important things for buyers. I felt at the time this more meant that buyers hated late orders but perhaps Fiverr took it literally as buyers want early deliveries.

Might be an idea to add a day to custom orders where possible.

[eoinfinnegan]

Thank you @eoinfinnegan !

I can definitely be off on the actual timeline of the update roll out, or it could also started affecting me later than others.

As for the bday, it is a big one: the big 4-0.

As for the bday, it is a big one: the big 4-0.

Oh, hope you did something nice!

My 4-0 is coming up later this year 😬

[frank_d]

Thanks for taking the time to explain your thinking - it makes sense.

Based on your theory, there are two types of on time delivery - one that won’t affect seller accounts, and another that will adversely affect seller accounts.

I’m now going to rethink how I handle deadlines. As I mentioned, I haven’t had a late delivery in four or five years - because I thought I was being efficient with pencilling in work and clearly communicating to buyers when they can expect their delivery.

However, it would appear my ‘efficiency’ might have been harming my account - despite delivering on time for 1,000+ days over several hundred orders.

The term ‘down to the wire’ is an interesting one. Let’s take a 24 hour service for example. Although I don’t advertise a 24 hour service, I do sometimes offer my trusted clients such a service for quick jobs. In this case is delivering after 12 hours and one second making the delivery ‘down to the wire’? I would say not. It’s basically half way through the buyer / seller agreed delivery time.

Also, in my opinion, successful and efficient freelance sellers ‘diary in’ work for completion. I’ve always thought ‘buyer beware’ if a seller is available for work immediately! Successful sellers tend to have one or two jobs on the go already. A good seller will communicate this to their buyer. Something like: “Thanks for your order. I am working on completing a job for a client this afternoon. I will be able to start work on your order in the morning and deliver by mid afternoon” - for example.

If your theory is correct (and it makes sense), then it’s unjust that Fiverr punishes sellers for simply delivering on time (albeit within the final 12 hours). If the ‘12 hours’ message is not just a friendly reminder but in fact a warning (and one that will adversely affect seller accounts), then Fiverr needs to be upfront and communicate this. For all the above reasons - on time delivery and clear communication - I consider myself to be a good seller.

But if Fiverr is artificially limiting my account and ability to attract new orders by taking into account the ‘12 hours’ message - then I need to know about it. I’ll adjust my business accordingly. This is one of those really frustrating (and harmful) aspects of Fiverr.

And yes, I note that yours is a theory. But it’s a very rational and well argued theory!

I completely understand what you are saying.

Just a reminder to step back and look at the whole picture:

This system is not in place to punish you, or restrain you, or hold you back and stop serving you with clients.

It’s you and then there are literally thousands of sellers doing the exact same thing you are doing. (in terms of niche and end product, not level of service necessarily).

So the system, which exists solely to make Fiverr money, needs to know when it is efficient to serve your gig, or when it’s efficient to serve someone else’s.

My post tried to distinguish between the two main metrics that drive this decision:

speed and relevancy.

So when you are handling 5 orders, you are definitely able to tell if you are at capacity, or if you can pencil more orders in if you got them.

But Fiverr doesn’t know that, so it relies on perhaps poor indicators, like when did you deliver, how long it takes you to get back to buyers, etc.

Yes, if an order is a 24-hour one, then this calculation changes. Suddenly the last 12 hours account for 50% of the time you had to work on the order.

My gigs have 15 day deliveries (for good reason), so in my case delivering after the “12 hour” notification is “down to the wire”.

Hope that clarifies things.

Regarding what I quoted… due to the nature of my work and the fact that unlike most writers here I actually don’t outsource, I deliver only within the “12 hours left” window. I don’t have any trouble ranking because of that. I noticed reviews, cancellations and late orders have a huge impact. At least in my case.

@donnovan86 thank you for sharing.

That actually does not disprove the existence of that marker.

Like I said my observations may be wrong. I may be wrong about how important that is, or I may have stumbled upon only a fraction of the equation.

If you regularly deliver within the “last 12 hours”, and you are doing just fine, then that means that this metric’s weight is not as important, or that other things are also factored in, like the average duration of your orders, how many orders you have at one time, how many out of those are under revision, and so on.

It’s definitely a lot more complicated than my initial post may have implied.

I just wanted to hint at the existence of those metrics, I have no way of knowing the exact formula or how they tie in with everything else.

The ideas you shared in this thread did u try in your gig? and get orders ?

I follow my own advice and I do get orders. But this post wasn’t made to be used as a “guide” to “get orders”.

[english_voice]

I completely understand what you are saying.

Just a reminder to step back and look at the whole picture:

This system is not in place to punish you, or restrain you, or hold you back and stop serving you with clients.

It’s you and then there are literally thousands of sellers doing the exact same thing you are doing. (in terms of niche and end product, not level of service necessarily).

So the system, which exists solely to make Fiverr money, needs to know when it is efficient to serve your gig, or when it’s efficient to serve someone else’s.

My post tried to distinguish between the two main metrics that drive this decision:

speed and relevancy.

So when you are handling 5 orders, you are definitely able to tell if you are at capacity, or if you can pencil more orders in if you got them.

But Fiverr doesn’t know that, so it relies on perhaps poor indicators, like when did you deliver, how long it takes you to get back to buyers, etc.

Yes, if an order is a 24-hour one, then this calculation changes. Suddenly the last 12 hours account for 50% of the time you had to work on the order.

My gigs have 15 day deliveries (for good reason), so in my case delivering after the “12 hour” notification is “down to the wire”.

Hope that clarifies things.

Regarding what I quoted… due to the nature of my work and the fact that unlike most writers here I actually don’t outsource, I deliver only within the “12 hours left” window. I don’t have any trouble ranking because of that. I noticed reviews, cancellations and late orders have a huge impact. At least in my case.

@donnovan86 thank you for sharing.

That actually does not disprove the existence of that marker.

Like I said my observations may be wrong. I may be wrong about how important that is, or I may have stumbled upon only a fraction of the equation.

If you regularly deliver within the “last 12 hours”, and you are doing just fine, then that means that this metric’s weight is not as important, or that other things are also factored in, like the average duration of your orders, how many orders you have at one time, how many out of those are under revision, and so on.

It’s definitely a lot more complicated than my initial post may have implied.

I just wanted to hint at the existence of those metrics, I have no way of knowing the exact formula or how they tie in with everything else.

The ideas you shared in this thread did u try in your gig? and get orders ?

I follow my own advice and I do get orders. But this post wasn’t made to be used as a “guide” to “get orders”.

It’s you and then there are literally thousands of sellers doing the exact same thing you are doing. (in terms of niche and end product, not level of service necessarily).

So the system, which exists solely to make Fiverr money, needs to know when it is efficient to serve your gig, or when it’s efficient to serve someone else’s.

I get it and, just in case it wasn’t clear in my post, I thank you for opening my eyes.

With hundreds of thousands of sellers in some niches, Fiverr clearly needs a way to differentiate between sellers.

But the system needs to be transparent, and that’s why I’m troubled by this! Maybe it was my interpretation that the ‘12 hour reminder’ was just that - a reminder.

Anyway! As I said, great post and it’s given me food for thought.

[frank_d]

It’s you and then there are literally thousands of sellers doing the exact same thing you are doing. (in terms of niche and end product, not level of service necessarily).

So the system, which exists solely to make Fiverr money, needs to know when it is efficient to serve your gig, or when it’s efficient to serve someone else’s.

I get it and, just in case it wasn’t clear in my post, I thank you for opening my eyes.

With hundreds of thousands of sellers in some niches, Fiverr clearly needs a way to differentiate between sellers.

But the system needs to be transparent, and that’s why I’m troubled by this! Maybe it was my interpretation that the ‘12 hour reminder’ was just that - a reminder.

Anyway! As I said, great post and it’s given me food for thought.

But the system needs to be transparent, and that’s why I’m troubled by this! Maybe it was my interpretation that the ‘12 hour reminder’ was just that - a reminder.

I could be 100% wrong about this.

It’s based on my personal observations and I could be mistaken about most of it.

This could very well be a simple reminder, just as well as it could be a reminder that’s also getting measured.

But have you noticed that we got a number of notifications we didn’t use to get in the past 2 years?

-the buyer is waiting on an update

-you have 12 hours to deliver

-the buyer is new to fiverr

-this is a VID buyer

-this is a business buyer

-check the requirements

-this is a Fiverr’s choice order

Maybe this is Fiverr being as transparent as they can be with us:

“You need to provide a great service, here’s what we need for you to do.”

[english_voice]

But the system needs to be transparent, and that’s why I’m troubled by this! Maybe it was my interpretation that the ‘12 hour reminder’ was just that - a reminder.

I could be 100% wrong about this.

It’s based on my personal observations and I could be mistaken about most of it.

This could very well be a simple reminder, just as well as it could be a reminder that’s also getting measured.

But have you noticed that we got a number of notifications we didn’t use to get in the past 2 years?

-the buyer is waiting on an update

-you have 12 hours to deliver

-the buyer is new to fiverr

-this is a VID buyer

-this is a business buyer

-check the requirements

-this is a Fiverr’s choice order

Maybe this is Fiverr being as transparent as they can be with us:

“You need to provide a great service, here’s what we need for you to do.”

But have you noticed that we got a number of notifications we didn’t use to get in the past 2 years?

-the buyer is waiting on an update

-you have 12 hours to deliver

-the buyer is new to fiverr

-this is a VID buyer

-this is a business buyer

-check the requirements

-this is a Fiverr’s choice order

Maybe this is Fiverr being as transparent as they can be with us:

“You need to provide a great service, here’s what we need for you to do.”

Yes, I have noticed. Your original post makes perfect sense. Thank you.

This thread is a perfect example of why the Fiverr forum can be so useful.

[genuineguidance]

But the system needs to be transparent, and that’s why I’m troubled by this! Maybe it was my interpretation that the ‘12 hour reminder’ was just that - a reminder.

I could be 100% wrong about this.

It’s based on my personal observations and I could be mistaken about most of it.

This could very well be a simple reminder, just as well as it could be a reminder that’s also getting measured.

But have you noticed that we got a number of notifications we didn’t use to get in the past 2 years?

-the buyer is waiting on an update

-you have 12 hours to deliver

-the buyer is new to fiverr

-this is a VID buyer

-this is a business buyer

-check the requirements

-this is a Fiverr’s choice order

Maybe this is Fiverr being as transparent as they can be with us:

“You need to provide a great service, here’s what we need for you to do.”

-check the requirements

Now that you brought that up, I have to wonder if that goes against you too? I get that message constantly and it irks me. I do not open up an order until I am ready to work on it OR if I feel there may be something missing. For some reason, I always know to look at those orders that will invariably be missing a key component I need to get the job done. I had one just last night, and sure enough, had to write to them asking for it.

So, I wonder, with this “check the requirements”, if you don’t OPEN the order and check to see if everything is there within 24 hours or whatever - if that also makes you look like you could care less about customer service?

Also, with the messages of

-the buyer is new to fiverr

There is always that “reach out and make their experience good” (or whatever it says). I wonder if I am supposed to be sending them a little greeting and thanking them for their order (before working on it!) and that I will be getting to their reading soon?

Lots to chew on. I don’t do either of the above - meaning, I do not send messages to new buyers welcoming them, I don’t check the requirements until I am ready to do their work OR unless I feel something may be missing.

Interesting.

GG

[frank_d]

-check the requirements

Now that you brought that up, I have to wonder if that goes against you too? I get that message constantly and it irks me. I do not open up an order until I am ready to work on it OR if I feel there may be something missing. For some reason, I always know to look at those orders that will invariably be missing a key component I need to get the job done. I had one just last night, and sure enough, had to write to them asking for it.

So, I wonder, with this “check the requirements”, if you don’t OPEN the order and check to see if everything is there within 24 hours or whatever - if that also makes you look like you could care less about customer service?

Also, with the messages of

-the buyer is new to fiverr

There is always that “reach out and make their experience good” (or whatever it says). I wonder if I am supposed to be sending them a little greeting and thanking them for their order (before working on it!) and that I will be getting to their reading soon?

Lots to chew on. I don’t do either of the above - meaning, I do not send messages to new buyers welcoming them, I don’t check the requirements until I am ready to do their work OR unless I feel something may be missing.

Interesting.

GG

Yes you are actually supposed to do both of the above if you are interested in providing your buyer with a pleasant journey.

This was covered extensively in the webinar I hosted and Fiverr staff was 100% in agreement with the claim that everything I shared on that webinar is directly tied to your profile’s performance.

Fiverr wants sellers to provide a better service.

You are of course free to ignore that.

[andrewcarpen756]

Great post Frank, very insightful.

I think sellers often get blindsided by the hidden metrics and also not take into account the different types of sellers on the platform that effects the “rankings”.

There are small fish, big fish and then there are the whales. I see many people complaining about gig ranking who might not work on the weekends, I often see people talking about gig de-ranking because they took a extended break from working, or sellers that take time to get back to buyers (10+ hours or even days).

Disclaimer breaks are essential for health / wellbeing and I am not saying taking breaks / having a good work life balance is a bad thing however there will be sellers (mostly the whales) who do not function like this. Often they have the recourses in place to be as effective as possible and run their gigs efficiently like a business.

It can be a tough marketplace and sometimes it might not just be because you have “dropped the ball” but rather than sellers around you are just out performing you.

Just my two cents 🙂

[aisohan]

Thanks for sharing this information :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:

[vickiespencer]

Hi there Frank.

Thank you SO much for sharing this.

My name is Kevin Storm. In the last months I had been stupendously busy drawing 16+ hours a day with my 2 gigs “I’ll draw anything” and “I’ll create NFT Cryproart”.

The app and site have been extremely, worryinly buggy for me with messages remaining unread (an issue dating back as far as 2016 as i can tell in forums), people not finding their deliveries (MANY autocompleted deliveries, even after I send many messages to reach customers) and much more. I can be having several conversations with people and they are all happy to go ahead and order and BOOM, all conversations stop simultaneously and customers never respond anymore.

In february I used the “promote your gig” feature. Many things happened;

-Both my gigs (over 300 5 star orders and rave reviews) dropped literally to the last spot on the last page.

• I suddenly did not appear at all and got zero customers, gig unpromotable. I found out this was because I used the words “many people leave me with 5 star review” in my FAQ section and without notification, Fiverr had completely blacklisted and removed my gig. I didnt know that was not allowed.

  I fixed the issue, but I never got back to where I was.

Oh and then I suddenly got an email with a rejection for Fiverr Pro that I never applied for.

No answer on that either. Bugs.

Fiverr is my only source of income, I am now jobless, except for the odd returning customer. I can’t sleep over this and I’ve literally been emailing customer support and twitter DAILY for over a month.

I sent close to 15 videos of the many issues and every day I get a “this has been forwarded to the relevant team” message. Until I asked if i could open a new account. I immediately got a warning that should I try that, I’d get them both banned.

We did a test here at home. My girlfriend ordered a drawing and we went through everything. As she accepted the delivery, her app crashed, and remained unusable on a locked screen for over an hour (didnt check if it works now). Closing the app, or phone didn’t bring the app back.

This worries me so much as perhaps people now can’t review the gig at all, or maybe just filled out 1 five star, app crashes and the other two remain at zero? I have no idea what is going on but I am crying here. I work harder than anyone out there and now am struggling to get even a single customer.

Another thing (sorry, last one) is that for my NFT gig, I was one of the first. The hype surrounding it is immesne and I was on top of the game, making great money. Someone ordered 4 drawings from me, and then started using MY drawings to list 4 gigs of his/her own that are now ranked way above me.

Perhaps they even left me with zero stars in the private “tell us in private what you thought of…” review people always get, who knows.

I would greatly greatly appreciate any help to get back to a basic income. If you can perhaps help me reach a human being on the customer support side or have a look at my keywords and metrics, I’d be extremely grateful. I’ll draw anything you want as a thank you 🙂 (This goes for anyone out there with the golden tip!) If you have a drawing gig and can’t finish your orders as you’re too busy, send them my way.

Fiverr was my lifeline, I’m very stressed about all this and can only hope they don’t see me as “that annoying seller who keeps complaining every day”.

Thank you for the explanation, I felt a slight relief and have a little hope now.

Kevin

I sent close to 15 videos of the many issues and every day I get a “this has been forwarded to the relevant team” message. Until I asked if i could open a new account. I immediately got a warning that should I try that, I’d get them both banned.

emailing customer support and twitter DAILY for over a month.

I do not mean to sound harsh because it sounds like you are very stressed over what has been happening in your Fiverr life. However, the actions you have taken, as stated above, may have made things worse for you and not better. I have read on the Forum that CS gets annoyed with people who write to them daily about issues, and soon, it may get marked as spam and is not dealt with at all. 😕

We did a test here at home. My girlfriend ordered a drawing and we went through everything. As she accepted the delivery, her app crashed, and remained unusable on a locked screen for over an hour (didnt check if it works now). Closing the app, or phone didn’t bring the app back.

This was really not good! 😱

More than likely, if you and your girlfriend were using the same wifi/IP, Fiverr thought you were ordering from yourself, which is against TOS, and they blocked the order. Alternatively, if you each have an account, Fiverr may have thought you had two accounts, and that is, again, against TOS, and your girlfriend’s order was blocked.

Fiverr was my lifeline, I’m very stressed about all this and can only hope they don’t see me as “that annoying seller who keeps complaining every day”.

I am afraid that this is exactly what has happened, and may be the root of some of your issues. :thinking:

I used the words “many people leave me with 5 star review”

Mentioning anything about reviews in your gigs, your profile, or in communication with buyers is seen as review manipulation by Fiverr. If you had spent much time at all on the Fiverr Forum, you would have been aware of that as it seems as if the topic is brought up daily. :roll_eyes:

I would greatly greatly appreciate any help to get back to a basic income. If you can perhaps help me reach a human being on the customer support side or have a look at my keywords and metrics, I’d be extremely grateful.

You can create a post in the Improve My Gigs category, and someone may help you, but it is not appropriate to ask in this thread as it is Off Topic according to the Forum rules. 😉

Good luck 🍀 getting back to where you were. I think holding off on contacting CS, for now, may be your best course of action for now. If nothing improves, once things have quieted down and CS has had time not to see you as that annoying seller, you could submit one ticket with the most pressing issue, and once it is solved, submit another.

[uk1000]

I sent close to 15 videos of the many issues and every day I get a “this has been forwarded to the relevant team” message. Until I asked if i could open a new account. I immediately got a warning that should I try that, I’d get them both banned.

emailing customer support and twitter DAILY for over a month.

I do not mean to sound harsh because it sounds like you are very stressed over what has been happening in your Fiverr life. However, the actions you have taken, as stated above, may have made things worse for you and not better. I have read on the Forum that CS gets annoyed with people who write to them daily about issues, and soon, it may get marked as spam and is not dealt with at all. 😕

We did a test here at home. My girlfriend ordered a drawing and we went through everything. As she accepted the delivery, her app crashed, and remained unusable on a locked screen for over an hour (didnt check if it works now). Closing the app, or phone didn’t bring the app back.

This was really not good! 😱

More than likely, if you and your girlfriend were using the same wifi/IP, Fiverr thought you were ordering from yourself, which is against TOS, and they blocked the order. Alternatively, if you each have an account, Fiverr may have thought you had two accounts, and that is, again, against TOS, and your girlfriend’s order was blocked.

Fiverr was my lifeline, I’m very stressed about all this and can only hope they don’t see me as “that annoying seller who keeps complaining every day”.

I am afraid that this is exactly what has happened, and may be the root of some of your issues. :thinking:

I used the words “many people leave me with 5 star review”

Mentioning anything about reviews in your gigs, your profile, or in communication with buyers is seen as review manipulation by Fiverr. If you had spent much time at all on the Fiverr Forum, you would have been aware of that as it seems as if the topic is brought up daily. :roll_eyes:

I would greatly greatly appreciate any help to get back to a basic income. If you can perhaps help me reach a human being on the customer support side or have a look at my keywords and metrics, I’d be extremely grateful.

You can create a post in the Improve My Gigs category, and someone may help you, but it is not appropriate to ask in this thread as it is Off Topic according to the Forum rules. 😉

Good luck 🍀 getting back to where you were. I think holding off on contacting CS, for now, may be your best course of action for now. If nothing improves, once things have quieted down and CS has had time not to see you as that annoying seller, you could submit one ticket with the most pressing issue, and once it is solved, submit another.

Mentioning anything about reviews in your gigs, your profile, or in communication with buyers is seen as review manipulation by Fiverr. If you had spent much time at all on the Fiverr Forum, you would have been aware of that as it seems as if the topic is brought up daily

Though I thought it was only if you mention reviews to the buyer (eg. in inbox/order page)/ pressure them into leaving a particular review or changing one, or putting badges in gig images. I agree putting it in the profile or gigs might influence people but there are multiple TRS who mention their 5 star reviews in their profile and at least one Fiverr Pro, and I assume Fiverr would have checked those.

[vickiespencer]

Mentioning anything about reviews in your gigs, your profile, or in communication with buyers is seen as review manipulation by Fiverr. If you had spent much time at all on the Fiverr Forum, you would have been aware of that as it seems as if the topic is brought up daily

Though I thought it was only if you mention reviews to the buyer (eg. in inbox/order page)/ pressure them into leaving a particular review or changing one, or putting badges in gig images. I agree putting it in the profile or gigs might influence people but there are multiple TRS who mention their 5 star reviews in their profile and at least one Fiverr Pro, and I assume Fiverr would have checked those.

but there are multiple TRS who mention their 5 star reviews in their profile and at least one Fiverr Pro, and I assume Fiverr would have checked those.

I have seen that. However, those sellers say something like, “I have 1000 5-star reviews.” This is different from saying ⬇️

“many people leave me with 5 star review”

To me, the first example is stating a fact, and the last is hinting that since many people have left a 5-star review, perhaps you should too. 😉