Why Face Recognition Technology is More Important

[gabrielluke]

Well I am from U.S.A but I have been staying in Pakistan for some time now. One thing I found quite strange while living here is that services like “biometrics” and “face,” are still not used in Pakistan at all. While I think all these services are normal in Abroad.
So I want to ask you what do you think services like “Face Recognition Online” Should implement?
Or everything is ok without it?

Thanks

[cyaxrex]

Face recognition and biometric ID systems are the most insecure security systems there are. All data needs to be held in a database. Databases get hacked everyday. Neither can you replace your face or thumbprint if you lose it like you can your password.

Businesses love to look modern and cool by using facial recognition, etc. In reality, we already live in an age where I can video you without you knowing and make a deep fake video of you or create a model of your face to bypass Microsoft Hello.

All companies also know that biometric security is spectacularly flawed, However, gathering as much biometric data you can on customers and employees is hugely profitable. You can sell and share this data to advertisers. They can then use this data to spot you in a mall and ensure that you get customized ads delivered to you via your smartphone and local store displays.

It’s nice to think that you could drive a car or own a home or work in a place where you and your property is super secure because everything is linked to your face, iris, thumb or a chip in your hand. In reality, this makes like super easy for criminals.

Criminals don’t need to go to the trouble of breaking into a home or torturing you to give up a password. They just need to grab a few seconds of video footage of you, lift your fingerprints from that cup you just threw away, or use a radio scanner to identify the frequency your RFID chip uses to communicate.

Facial recognition is nor important for security. Strong passwords and privacy are.

[gabrielluke]

Face recognition and biometric ID systems are the most insecure security systems there are. All data needs to be held in a database. Databases get hacked everyday. Neither can you replace your face or thumbprint if you lose it like you can your password.

Businesses love to look modern and cool by using facial recognition, etc. In reality, we already live in an age where I can video you without you knowing and make a deep fake video of you or create a model of your face to bypass Microsoft Hello.

All companies also know that biometric security is spectacularly flawed, However, gathering as much biometric data you can on customers and employees is hugely profitable. You can sell and share this data to advertisers. They can then use this data to spot you in a mall and ensure that you get customized ads delivered to you via your smartphone and local store displays.

It’s nice to think that you could drive a car or own a home or work in a place where you and your property is super secure because everything is linked to your face, iris, thumb or a chip in your hand. In reality, this makes like super easy for criminals.

Criminals don’t need to go to the trouble of breaking into a home or torturing you to give up a password. They just need to grab a few seconds of video footage of you, lift your fingerprints from that cup you just threw away, or use a radio scanner to identify the frequency your RFID chip uses to communicate.

Facial recognition is nor important for security. Strong passwords and privacy are.

I agree with your point a lot, but one thing I do not understand is that what we have created to protect ourselves can become our weakness. I’m not sure how thieves or fraudsters can hack such a sophisticated system. And as far as I know, this “Facial Recognition” is often used for business purposes so that they can find out about their partner or the people with whom they have a deal that is not always legal. Or to avoid AML, mean Anti Money Laundering.

[cyaxrex]

I agree with your point a lot, but one thing I do not understand is that what we have created to protect ourselves can become our weakness. I’m not sure how thieves or fraudsters can hack such a sophisticated system. And as far as I know, this “Facial Recognition” is often used for business purposes so that they can find out about their partner or the people with whom they have a deal that is not always legal. Or to avoid AML, mean Anti Money Laundering.

I’m not sure how thieves or fraudsters can hack such a sophisticated system.

It’s not sophisticated in any way. That is the problem. If you own a $100K+ Tesla that you can unlock and drive with your fingerprint, all I need to do to steal your $100K+ car is cut off your thumb.

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

You also already have people creating fun apps like the app that shows what you will look like in 50-years, where they explicitly state in app privacy policies that they will be keeping and sharing all the facial recognition data their app collects.

People believe these systems are sophisticated and unbreakable. However, they are really the easiest to compromise because they rely on authentication data which can be collected by anyone, any time.

[gabrielluke]

I’m not sure how thieves or fraudsters can hack such a sophisticated system.

It’s not sophisticated in any way. That is the problem. If you own a $100K+ Tesla that you can unlock and drive with your fingerprint, all I need to do to steal your $100K+ car is cut off your thumb.

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

You also already have people creating fun apps like the app that shows what you will look like in 50-years, where they explicitly state in app privacy policies that they will be keeping and sharing all the facial recognition data their app collects.

People believe these systems are sophisticated and unbreakable. However, they are really the easiest to compromise because they rely on authentication data which can be collected by anyone, any time.

Looks like you must have had an accident in life with “Face Security System”, as opposed to you. I’ve been following your golden words, but so far, everyone I’ve met has said this is the best of them.

Anyway Thanks for your suggestions and clarification.

[miiila]

It has its uses and can be super convenient. You need to weight convenience//security, like with the other options.
You also need to weight whether you’re more comfy with all kinds of organisations and partnered 3rd party organisations (plus the potential hackers/leakers, etc., it’s more a question of when than if) having your face linked to programs, sites you’re surfing, things you’re buying, etc. versus your password.

[gabrielluke]

It has its uses and can be super convenient. You need to weight convenience//security, like with the other options.

You also need to weight whether you’re more comfy with all kinds of organisations and partnered 3rd party organisations (plus the potential hackers/leakers, etc., it’s more a question of when than if) having your face linked to programs, sites you’re surfing, things you’re buying, etc. versus your password.

Sorry, miiila. I can’t get your point about "you’re more comfy with all kinds of organisations and partnered 3rd party organisations (plus the potential hackers/leakers, etc., it’s more a question of when than if) can you please explain it more?

[miiila]

I’m not sure how thieves or fraudsters can hack such a sophisticated system.

It’s not sophisticated in any way. That is the problem. If you own a $100K+ Tesla that you can unlock and drive with your fingerprint, all I need to do to steal your $100K+ car is cut off your thumb.

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

You also already have people creating fun apps like the app that shows what you will look like in 50-years, where they explicitly state in app privacy policies that they will be keeping and sharing all the facial recognition data their app collects.

People believe these systems are sophisticated and unbreakable. However, they are really the easiest to compromise because they rely on authentication data which can be collected by anyone, any time.

Yes, sure. With “question of when than if”, I mean that it happens so often, even with big organisations, who we tend to think must have everything under control, that people who work in the industry will tell you that it’s not a question of if something will get hacked, some staff member wants to earn some side-cash or gets sacked and feels revengey, but a question of when. Not too long ago, there was a major security breach at a company I hosted a website with, an insider job, the customer data including name/address/banking information, was compromised. We (customers) also got informed about this weeks, or even months, after the fact, because of the ongoing investigations, the website was dysfunctional for a while too. You certainly have read about similar things happening to many major companies who have whole departments taking care of security and such issues, and still, it happens.

By “partnered 3rd party organisations”, I’m referring to lots and lots of websites’ terms of service that state that they enable 3rd parties to access your data with them, if now for advertising or other purposes.

If face recognition technology is indeed easier to compromise, it would be a step backwards instead of forwards in matters of security. The safest might then be to combine older and newer methods, however, that again will be at the cost of convenience, which many people don’t want to pay - and which in many use cases, probably isn’t worth paying too.

For instance, online banking or your Google account with lots of valuable mails, holiday pictures, docs, etc., or your FB account, or a government-critical forum you frequent, etc., might be worth it to you to accept the inconvenience of 2FA but a reddit account where you post only twice a month some funny “Today I learned that …” stuff might not. If that account got hijacked, well, you may want to risk that.

How probably scenarios like

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

are, depends a lot on you, of course, and how interested people are in unlocking your phone or PC 😉

I love and use the fingerprint sensor in my phone to unlock the phone itself, plus a lot of the apps I use, the phone has a higher probability of getting lost or stolen, as I take it with me most of the time. I have a microsoft surface pro, which usually is at home, unless I’m on vacation, which I rarely am. I do use the integrated “windows hello” facial recognition there, because it’s fun and I’m not really afraid of anyone logging into that device, I don’t really do anything critical with it.

I don’t think it’s all black and white. Depends on what you do, who you are, how convenient/secure you want it, …

[mondolshoukhin]

Face recognition and biometric ID systems are the most insecure security systems there are. All data needs to be held in a database. Databases get hacked everyday. Neither can you replace your face or thumbprint if you lose it like you can your password.

Businesses love to look modern and cool by using facial recognition, etc. In reality, we already live in an age where I can video you without you knowing and make a deep fake video of you or create a model of your face to bypass Microsoft Hello.

All companies also know that biometric security is spectacularly flawed, However, gathering as much biometric data you can on customers and employees is hugely profitable. You can sell and share this data to advertisers. They can then use this data to spot you in a mall and ensure that you get customized ads delivered to you via your smartphone and local store displays.

It’s nice to think that you could drive a car or own a home or work in a place where you and your property is super secure because everything is linked to your face, iris, thumb or a chip in your hand. In reality, this makes like super easy for criminals.

Criminals don’t need to go to the trouble of breaking into a home or torturing you to give up a password. They just need to grab a few seconds of video footage of you, lift your fingerprints from that cup you just threw away, or use a radio scanner to identify the frequency your RFID chip uses to communicate.

Facial recognition is nor important for security. Strong passwords and privacy are.

Well said, Brother 👏

[cyaxrex]

Yes, sure. With “question of when than if”, I mean that it happens so often, even with big organisations, who we tend to think must have everything under control, that people who work in the industry will tell you that it’s not a question of if something will get hacked, some staff member wants to earn some side-cash or gets sacked and feels revengey, but a question of when. Not too long ago, there was a major security breach at a company I hosted a website with, an insider job, the customer data including name/address/banking information, was compromised. We (customers) also got informed about this weeks, or even months, after the fact, because of the ongoing investigations, the website was dysfunctional for a while too. You certainly have read about similar things happening to many major companies who have whole departments taking care of security and such issues, and still, it happens.

By “partnered 3rd party organisations”, I’m referring to lots and lots of websites’ terms of service that state that they enable 3rd parties to access your data with them, if now for advertising or other purposes.

If face recognition technology is indeed easier to compromise, it would be a step backwards instead of forwards in matters of security. The safest might then be to combine older and newer methods, however, that again will be at the cost of convenience, which many people don’t want to pay - and which in many use cases, probably isn’t worth paying too.

For instance, online banking or your Google account with lots of valuable mails, holiday pictures, docs, etc., or your FB account, or a government-critical forum you frequent, etc., might be worth it to you to accept the inconvenience of 2FA but a reddit account where you post only twice a month some funny “Today I learned that …” stuff might not. If that account got hijacked, well, you may want to risk that.

How probably scenarios like

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

are, depends a lot on you, of course, and how interested people are in unlocking your phone or PC 😉

I love and use the fingerprint sensor in my phone to unlock the phone itself, plus a lot of the apps I use, the phone has a higher probability of getting lost or stolen, as I take it with me most of the time. I have a microsoft surface pro, which usually is at home, unless I’m on vacation, which I rarely am. I do use the integrated “windows hello” facial recognition there, because it’s fun and I’m not really afraid of anyone logging into that device, I don’t really do anything critical with it.

I don’t think it’s all black and white. Depends on what you do, who you are, how convenient/secure you want it, …

How probably scenarios like

cyaxrex:

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

All Android and IOS devices use what is called point cloud software to help measure depth in images and map wifi signal strengths. You can even use it as radar to map your surroundings. As Android is opensource, it is possible for anyone anywhere to get hold of and modify this software to use for their own purposes.

Considering that most people now go online using mobile devices, I think it highly likely that people are already using this and other methods to harvest data needed to compromise the security of devices. It’s not exactly like a thief ever sits at home and says, "alas, all this robbing people is so much hard work, I might as well give up."

[miiila]

How probably scenarios like

cyaxrex:

When you unlock your phone or PC or home with facial recognition, you do so after taking a selfie and moving your head around a bit. If I have a phone, I can take a picture of you too and use the same technology to make a virtual or 3D printed model of your face.

All Android and IOS devices use what is called point cloud software to help measure depth in images and map wifi signal strengths. You can even use it as radar to map your surroundings. As Android is opensource, it is possible for anyone anywhere to get hold of and modify this software to use for their own purposes.

Considering that most people now go online using mobile devices, I think it highly likely that people are already using this and other methods to harvest data needed to compromise the security of devices. It’s not exactly like a thief ever sits at home and says, "alas, all this robbing people is so much hard work, I might as well give up."

It’s not exactly like a thief ever sits at home and says, "alas, all this robbing people is so much hard work, I might as well give up."

I’m not so sure there, they might not give up but find something easier to do, however, I won’t follow that train of thought, and it would be OT anyway, sorry, gabrielluke, I’m out already 🙂

[lifamathula]

Face recognition and biometric ID systems are the most insecure security systems there are. All data needs to be held in a database. Databases get hacked everyday. Neither can you replace your face or thumbprint if you lose it like you can your password.

Businesses love to look modern and cool by using facial recognition, etc. In reality, we already live in an age where I can video you without you knowing and make a deep fake video of you or create a model of your face to bypass Microsoft Hello.

All companies also know that biometric security is spectacularly flawed, However, gathering as much biometric data you can on customers and employees is hugely profitable. You can sell and share this data to advertisers. They can then use this data to spot you in a mall and ensure that you get customized ads delivered to you via your smartphone and local store displays.

It’s nice to think that you could drive a car or own a home or work in a place where you and your property is super secure because everything is linked to your face, iris, thumb or a chip in your hand. In reality, this makes like super easy for criminals.

Criminals don’t need to go to the trouble of breaking into a home or torturing you to give up a password. They just need to grab a few seconds of video footage of you, lift your fingerprints from that cup you just threw away, or use a radio scanner to identify the frequency your RFID chip uses to communicate.

Facial recognition is nor important for security. Strong passwords and privacy are.

yeah i agree with you