VO for ebooks = Commercial or Broadcast

[gina_riley2]

Just as the title says, is getting voice over for ebook considered commercial use or broadcast right?

Also, I’d like to get a written contract from seller indicating I purchased the proper license. I want to cover myself in case the seller leaves 5r or site crashes or whatever else may happen.

I know someone asked few days ago and mature actress gave a pretty good answer, but that is something she does.

Does 5r have a standard, written contract that they can use to give buyers? Outside 5r there are at a minimum, written agreement between sellers and buyers.

Thanks

[radie16]

Hi, Gina. I’m not sure about your first question but I’d love to know that as well. As far as your second question about creating a license, I think that’s a great idea and I understand why you’d want that. If the seller does not offer that, I would think the proof of purchase would be sufficient legally, but who knows. I have no legal experience. 😁

[newsmike]

Just as the title says, is getting voice over for ebook considered commercial use or broadcast right?

Also, I’d like to get a written contract from seller indicating I purchased the proper license. I want to cover myself in case the seller leaves 5r or site crashes or whatever else may happen.

I know someone asked few days ago and mature actress gave a pretty good answer, but that is something she does.

Does 5r have a standard, written contract that they can use to give buyers? Outside 5r there are at a minimum, written agreement between sellers and buyers.

Thanks

Does 5r have a standard, written contract that they can use to give buyers? Outside 5r there are at a minimum, written agreement between sellers and buyers.

There really should be some standard form that we can output indicating the order number, date and license. This could easily be output by the fiverr system when one of the licenses is purchased and then be simply delivered with the VO.

[gina_riley2]

Does 5r have a standard, written contract that they can use to give buyers? Outside 5r there are at a minimum, written agreement between sellers and buyers.

There really should be some standard form that we can output indicating the order number, date and license. This could easily be output by the fiverr system when one of the licenses is purchased and then be simply delivered with the VO.

Yes, that’s exactly what I am looking for.

I don’t need sellers real name. I need an attachment with 5r logo and the seller and my username.

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I’ll have something to print out and tuck it into a folder in case any questions arise when marketing my books on Amazon, or where ever.

So, ebooks, commercial or broadcast? Anyone??

[newsmike]

Yes, that’s exactly what I am looking for.

I don’t need sellers real name. I need an attachment with 5r logo and the seller and my username.

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I’ll have something to print out and tuck it into a folder in case any questions arise when marketing my books on Amazon, or where ever.

So, ebooks, commercial or broadcast? Anyone??

Absolutely agree. How would we even approach fiverr to start the discussion? The current situation is not ideal as it is not consistent. This would insure that people spending $100 for that broadcast license really are covering themselves legally.

Fiverr can require that we as sellers agree to their terms of transfer of license/ownership. Then you get cert from fiverr. So all is clean and cannot be argued.

[smashradio]

The TOS covers the broadcast license though. Isn’t that coverage enough?

[gina_riley2]

The TOS covers the broadcast license though. Isn’t that coverage enough?

TOS constantly changes and sometimes it’s completely removed or amended.

My main question is what an eBook VO is under?

[markusvoice]

In my opinion and experience it’s under neither…
In my non-fiverr voiceover life I’ve used a narrator release agreement that served as a full release (with payment information), my rights to use the audio in my portfolio and the extent of the client’s use between the producer/narrator (me) and the author/media company (client).
There are actually 3 areas to consider: Commercial, Broadcast and Non-broadcast. An ebook would fall under non-broadcast, similar to training, on-hold messages and miscellaneous corporate internal reads.

This might not help…but this is the reason it no longer do audio books on fiverr…no residuals 🙂

[gina_riley2]

In my opinion and experience it’s under neither…

In my non-fiverr voiceover life I’ve used a narrator release agreement that served as a full release (with payment information), my rights to use the audio in my portfolio and the extent of the client’s use between the producer/narrator (me) and the author/media company (client).

There are actually 3 areas to consider: Commercial, Broadcast and Non-broadcast. An ebook would fall under non-broadcast, similar to training, on-hold messages and miscellaneous corporate internal reads.

This might not help…but this is the reason it no longer do audio books on fiverr…no residuals 🙂

Thank you very much!

This is the information I needed. I am not doing the whole book, just the book blurb in various languages for my website - to see if it helps with sales. I am constantly experimenting to see what works and doesn’t and in which country a certain theme works.

🙂

[Anna]

I would say it depends on the gig and the seller itself. Talk to the seller to see if you can find an agreement. Have the seller issue a detailed custom offer to make sure all rights and licenses are included. You can print the custom offer along with the order details and save them for your convenience. You probably read through the article listed below but I am still going to paste it here just in case you haven’t ;).

Here is a short copy of Fiverr’s TOS “Ownership for VO”

For Voice Over Gigs, when the work is delivered, and subject to payment, the buyer is purchasing basic rights, (which means the buyer is paying a one time fee allowing them to use the work forever and for any purpose except for commercials, radio, television and internet commercial spots).

If you intend to use the Voice Over to promote a product and/or service (with the exception of paid marketing channels), you will need to purchase the Commercial Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra. If you intend to use the Voice Over in radio, television and internet commercials, you will need to purchase the Full Broadcast Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra…

You can find the full article under Fiverr’s TOS “Ownership”. I hope that helps.

[gina_riley2]

I would say it depends on the gig and the seller itself. Talk to the seller to see if you can find an agreement. Have the seller issue a detailed custom offer to make sure all rights and licenses are included. You can print the custom offer along with the order details and save them for your convenience. You probably read through the article listed below but I am still going to paste it here just in case you haven’t ;).

Here is a short copy of Fiverr’s TOS “Ownership for VO”

For Voice Over Gigs, when the work is delivered, and subject to payment, the buyer is purchasing basic rights, (which means the buyer is paying a one time fee allowing them to use the work forever and for any purpose except for commercials, radio, television and internet commercial spots).

If you intend to use the Voice Over to promote a product and/or service (with the exception of paid marketing channels), you will need to purchase the Commercial Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra. If you intend to use the Voice Over in radio, television and internet commercials, you will need to purchase the Full Broadcast Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra…

You can find the full article under Fiverr’s TOS “Ownership”. I hope that helps.

internet commercial spots

Actually, I do not understand the internet commercial spots portion of the TOS.

From what markus was saying, if I would to record a book blurb voiceover for my website - that is not considered commercial spot or internet spot?

I’m so confused. Maybe, I’ll just scrap the whole idea.

[Anna]

internet commercial spots

Actually, I do not understand the internet commercial spots portion of the TOS.

From what markus was saying, if I would to record a book blurb voiceover for my website - that is not considered commercial spot or internet spot?

I’m so confused. Maybe, I’ll just scrap the whole idea.

I know it can get pretty confusing and overwhelming. I would think a commercial license for a book blurp would be totally fine. Overall you are advertising and promoting your own book on your website.

https://support.fiverr.com/hc/en-us/articles/204791227--For-Commercial-Use-License-Details-

[sydneymorgan]

Yes, that’s exactly what I am looking for.

I don’t need sellers real name. I need an attachment with 5r logo and the seller and my username.

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I’ll have something to print out and tuck it into a folder in case any questions arise when marketing my books on Amazon, or where ever.

So, ebooks, commercial or broadcast? Anyone??

I don’t need sellers real name. I need an attachment with 5r logo and the seller and my username.

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I don’t think a legal agreement without any identifying information for either party would hold up in court (but giving that information would be against the TOS as all users are meant to remain anonymous).

Like you said, if the user leaves Fiverr, how are you supposed to prove you own rights to the voiceover? All you have is a document that says DiscoBot sold it to you on Day/Month/Year. When someone goes to Fiverr.com/DiscoBot and he’s not there anymore, what proof do you have?

In this case, I think your invoice is just as good (showing order number, date, usernames, and that you purchased the license extra).

[andycancun]

I don’t need sellers real name. I need an attachment with 5r logo and the seller and my username.

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I don’t think a legal agreement without any identifying information for either party would hold up in court (but giving that information would be against the TOS as all users are meant to remain anonymous).

Like you said, if the user leaves Fiverr, how are you supposed to prove you own rights to the voiceover? All you have is a document that says DiscoBot sold it to you on Day/Month/Year. When someone goes to Fiverr.com/DiscoBot and he’s not there anymore, what proof do you have?

In this case, I think your invoice is just as good (showing order number, date, usernames, and that you purchased the license extra).

Something put together by Fiverr would alleviate the anonymity issue. It could be ust something where we could check a few boxes and send a form to clients along with their order. I think it would help to give some validity to the whole concept of paying for the rights. Many people who buy voice over work on fiverr are new to being voice over buyers. An Additional form, whether it holds up in court or not, gives a little more validity to the concept.

For my clients away from this platform, it’s a standard part of a job order. Of course, they are jobs with people here in my country of residence and subject to certain laws, but it would be a step toward making this situation more professional and perhaps deter shady dealings. Props to the OP for the idea. I hope the all-hearing ears of 5er are listening.

cheers form Cancun!

Andy

[gina_riley2]

Something put together by Fiverr would alleviate the anonymity issue. It could be ust something where we could check a few boxes and send a form to clients along with their order. I think it would help to give some validity to the whole concept of paying for the rights. Many people who buy voice over work on fiverr are new to being voice over buyers. An Additional form, whether it holds up in court or not, gives a little more validity to the concept.

For my clients away from this platform, it’s a standard part of a job order. Of course, they are jobs with people here in my country of residence and subject to certain laws, but it would be a step toward making this situation more professional and perhaps deter shady dealings. Props to the OP for the idea. I hope the all-hearing ears of 5er are listening.

cheers form Cancun!

Andy

5r comes up with ideas to make additional money and try to help sellers get fair compensation. I think it’s a great concept, but they seem to hurriedly put together a short ToS and tell the seller -

“Here you go, do this.”

Great, now what?

Buyers are left confused with many questions.

• What if I bought this before the ToS went into effect?
• What if I bought before the ToS but hadn’t used it until after the implementation?
• How do I prove the seller at the time I purchased it, did not have it on his/her profile and now does?
• What if I want to use it for this case (insert scenario not covered in ToS)

Almost every site, outside of 5r, has a legal disclaimer of some sort that is given to the buyer. 5r is trying to place themselves as a professional site with professional gigs, yet their conduct in just tossing money making ideas without giving buyers anything solid other than,

“Pay more and show your transaction page as proof” isn’t exactly professional.

I’m considering scrapping the whole record voice over for book blurb idea. I’m not sure what I am supposed to get and the ToS isn’t clear.

Good evening from the good old, USA! 🙂

[sue_mcl]

I would say it depends on the gig and the seller itself. Talk to the seller to see if you can find an agreement. Have the seller issue a detailed custom offer to make sure all rights and licenses are included. You can print the custom offer along with the order details and save them for your convenience. You probably read through the article listed below but I am still going to paste it here just in case you haven’t ;).

Here is a short copy of Fiverr’s TOS “Ownership for VO”

For Voice Over Gigs, when the work is delivered, and subject to payment, the buyer is purchasing basic rights, (which means the buyer is paying a one time fee allowing them to use the work forever and for any purpose except for commercials, radio, television and internet commercial spots).

If you intend to use the Voice Over to promote a product and/or service (with the exception of paid marketing channels), you will need to purchase the Commercial Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra. If you intend to use the Voice Over in radio, television and internet commercials, you will need to purchase the Full Broadcast Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra…

You can find the full article under Fiverr’s TOS “Ownership”. I hope that helps.

For Voice Over Gigs, when the work is delivered, and subject to payment, the buyer is purchasing basic rights, (which means the buyer is paying a one time fee allowing them to use the work forever and for any purpose except for commercials, radio, television and internet commercial spots).

If you intend to use the Voice Over to promote a product and/or service (with the exception of paid marketing channels), you will need to purchase the Commercial Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra. If you intend to use the Voice Over in radio, television and internet commercials, you will need to purchase the Full Broadcast Rights (Buy-Out) through Gig Extra…

It might be tricky relying on fiverr’s TOS in that way, as I personally don’t think internet should be included in broadcast - just TV and Radio, so I instruct my clients to just purchase a commercial license - NOT broadcast if it is for internet use. I used to just offer all my gigs inclusive of the commercial license before the recent VO category changes, but then I had too many buyers worried they couldn’t use it for commercial use when that wasn’t an option (and I was no longer able to tick it as included in the base pricing).

I also think it might be best to talk to each individual seller. I haven’t had anyone ask for it, but I’d be more than happy to give a short written doc to sign off on the usage - though it would be handy if fiverr could automatically do it.

[fastcopywriter]

Anything you do for clients becomes their property. Remember, they’re paying you. If Picasso paints a painting and you buy it, you can burn it, you can trash it, or you can sell it to someone else.

The whole “commercial license” is a bunch of nonsense some sellers offer to get more money from buyers. Fiverr allows it because it also makes Fiverr money.

Besides, how can you write a contract without violating TOS? Contracts demand extremely sensitive information such as names, addresses, telephone numbers, e-mails, tax ID, etc.

If a contract is broken, who do you sue? What if the buyer or seller on Fiverr has a fake account? What if he gives you a fake name?

Look everyone, all you have to do is do your job, deliver, and forget about it. That’s it. Don’t bother with contracts, don’t sign anything, don’t s***e (unless you have a s***e gig), don’t exchange personal information, and you’ll be fine.

Besides, even with a contract, your buyer can do a PayPal chargeback. This is why I fear big projects. Imagine you spent 40 hours recording a 250 page book. How would you feel if they do a chargeback? At least with Audible you’re protected from PayPal chargebacks, on Fiverr, you’re not.

[misscrystal]

Yes, that’s exactly what I am looking for.

I don’t need sellers real name. I need an attachment with 5r logo and the seller and my username.

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I’ll have something to print out and tuck it into a folder in case any questions arise when marketing my books on Amazon, or where ever.

So, ebooks, commercial or broadcast? Anyone??

I, newsmike, voiceover artist on 5r, acknowledge that the buyer, gina_riley2, has purchased proper license on this date _____on the form of broadcast/commercial for product xyz to be used as ______.

I love this idea. To be nitpicky, the name newsmike could be replaced with “Mike Smith doing business on fiverr as newsmike”. But that is probably not necessary.

[misscrystal]

Anything you do for clients becomes their property. Remember, they’re paying you. If Picasso paints a painting and you buy it, you can burn it, you can trash it, or you can sell it to someone else.

The whole “commercial license” is a bunch of nonsense some sellers offer to get more money from buyers. Fiverr allows it because it also makes Fiverr money.

Besides, how can you write a contract without violating TOS? Contracts demand extremely sensitive information such as names, addresses, telephone numbers, e-mails, tax ID, etc.

If a contract is broken, who do you sue? What if the buyer or seller on Fiverr has a fake account? What if he gives you a fake name?

Look everyone, all you have to do is do your job, deliver, and forget about it. That’s it. Don’t bother with contracts, don’t sign anything, don’t s***e (unless you have a s***e gig), don’t exchange personal information, and you’ll be fine.

Besides, even with a contract, your buyer can do a PayPal chargeback. This is why I fear big projects. Imagine you spent 40 hours recording a 250 page book. How would you feel if they do a chargeback? At least with Audible you’re protected from PayPal chargebacks, on Fiverr, you’re not.

The whole “commercial license” is a bunch of nonsense some sellers offer to get more money from buyers. Fiverr allows it because it also makes Fiverr money.

Besides, how can you write a contract without violating TOS? Contracts demand extremely sensitive information such as names, addresses, telephone numbers, e-mails, tax ID, etc.

If a contract is broken, who do you sue? What if the buyer or seller on Fiverr has a fake account? What if he gives you a fake name?

This is how I feel but was too polite to say it.

The TOS of fiverr says you own what you receive from a seller. That means you can do what you want with it.

What if a buyer does not buy the commercial license but used the VO in a commercial way? What recourse would a seller have? A judge would look at the terms of service of fiverr and dismiss the lawsuit.

And simply paying for a commercial license without a properly written contract is worthless. A well written contract is what would make the commercial license valid.

[fastcopywriter]

The whole “commercial license” is a bunch of nonsense some sellers offer to get more money from buyers. Fiverr allows it because it also makes Fiverr money.

Besides, how can you write a contract without violating TOS? Contracts demand extremely sensitive information such as names, addresses, telephone numbers, e-mails, tax ID, etc.

If a contract is broken, who do you sue? What if the buyer or seller on Fiverr has a fake account? What if he gives you a fake name?

This is how I feel but was too polite to say it.

The TOS of fiverr says you own what you receive from a seller. That means you can do what you want with it.

What if a buyer does not buy the commercial license but used the VO in a commercial way? What recourse would a seller have? A judge would look at the terms of service of fiverr and dismiss the lawsuit.

And simply paying for a commercial license without a properly written contract is worthless. A well written contract is what would make the commercial license valid.

Exactly, besides, Fiverr is a commerce platform, people come here to buy and sell. When I buy a vending machine, I don’t have to pay for a commercial license, the seller doesn’t care if the vending machine is a decoration for my home or if it will be in a laundromat making money. Fiverr sellers shouldn’t care either, they should remember that they’re working for other people, creating for other people, and that they are no longer owners of their creations once the client accepts delivery.

[misscrystal]

Exactly, besides, Fiverr is a commerce platform, people come here to buy and sell. When I buy a vending machine, I don’t have to pay for a commercial license, the seller doesn’t care if the vending machine is a decoration for my home or if it will be in a laundromat making money. Fiverr sellers shouldn’t care either, they should remember that they’re working for other people, creating for other people, and that they are no longer owners of their creations once the client accepts delivery.

However there IS something called an implied contract so that might be what you are getting when you pay for a commercial license, an implied contract to use it in a commercial way without any written contract.

BUT the implied contract would also be included with any voiceover without paying for the commercial license, unless there is already established law governing this as for instance there is with model release contracts.

[radie16]

It is up to the seller. So we can decide to include Commercial Rights or not in our offering. This is standard practice with this kind of thing. Even when purchasing something like a font from someone, they’ll have different charges for personal and commercial use. It may not make sense to you, but companies want to cover their bases when it comes to future issues and the Commercial / Broadcast Rights take care of that.

From the TOS page
https://support.fiverr.com/hc/en-us/articles/204827497-Copyright-and-Intellectual-Property-Rights

Who Owns the Copyright?
On the Fiverr platform, buyers are granted all rights for the delivered work, unless otherwise specified by the seller on their Gig page.

Note: Some Gigs charge additional payments (through Gig Extras) for commercial use.

This means that if you purchase the Gig for personal use, you will own all rights to the delivered work without purchasing the Extra. If you intend to use it for business purposes, you will need to buy the Extra. Fiverr retains the right to use all published delivered works for Fiverr marketing and promotion purposes. If you have more questions, visit our complete Terms of Service.

[misscrystal]

https://support.fiverr.com/hc/en-us/articles/204791227--For-Commercial-Use-License-Details-

If I had a gig and offered a commercial use license as an extra I would have a nice looking certificate that I sent along with the delivery spelling out what they are getting with it.

[radie16]

Yep! It is definitely all about non-tangibles, but part of the business.

[misscrystal]

So for sellers who do not offer that as an extra you get that included at no extra charge I guess.